this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2023
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[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 146 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Because the 'numbers' that neoliberals have decided are the indicators of a "good" economy mean almost nothing to, in all likely hood, 95% of Americans.

Measuring the right thing leads to inconvenient conclusions (age till retirement, income at retirement, income independence, buying power, home ownership, business ownership, union membership, etc.)

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 60 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Bloody well hate the neoliberals. One was arguing with me on reddit that because people in Kenya are better off, compared to the 80s, I should stop complaining.

Like ok I am happy for the people of Kenya. I got nothing against them. So yeah good job. Now can my healthcare costs please go down? Because I am pretty confident that they can and the people of Kenya can also be doing well. One really doesn't impact the other that much.

[–] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 26 points 9 months ago (1 children)

No, you see, because TVs have gotten consistently cheaper (they're like the only thing to have done so), everything's working!

[–] ayaya@lemdro.id 24 points 9 months ago

And the main reason they're cheaper is because all of them are data harvesting machines. What a fun world where even your habits are a commodity!

[–] rambaroo@lemmy.world 11 points 9 months ago

Like they even give a shit about Kenya. Just blatant manipulation.

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[–] azimir@lemmy.ml 109 points 9 months ago (2 children)

... because my purchasing power is much lower than two years ago and my wages aren't remotely keeping up with profiteering inflation? Because I have to be very careful around Christmas to not overspend and I get to explain to the kids why there's only a few presents under the tree? They'll be okay with it, but as a person who has children to take care of it, it's crushing to go backwards year to year in what you're able to provide? Because a 3/4 full shopping cart today (not much meat) was $179 today? And we have a fixed rate mortgage! I can't envision the pressures people who are renting or trying to buy a home right now are going through. Anyone saying "it's all good out there!" can get fucked.

[–] TheDubz87@lemmy.world 49 points 9 months ago (2 children)

No kids to take care of, but my fridge just went out today. This spoiled most of the food in the fridge as I can't pick up a new one until tomorrow, and the of a new fridge and restocking my fridge pretty much cancels Xmas gifts for the family. I feel bad every year because they get my wife and I all kinds of cool stuff and it seems like every year I'm stuck telling them, "Maybe I'll be less broke next year" Not quite the same, I know, but it still makes me feel aweful...

Meanwhile the owner of my company just bought a 5th wheel camper trailer and hitch for his truck in June because he felt like going camping, and is having a 6 bedroom house built for his son on his ranch because his sons wife is having a baby.

This world is fucked for the working class truly.

[–] Patches@sh.itjust.works 12 points 9 months ago

If it isn't too late. Buy an absolute fuck ton of ice. It'll keep the food cold enough.

[–] Kage520@lemmy.world 12 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This isn't probably what you want to hear right now, but I've been much happier giving homemade gifts to family and friends. I found a couple of things people really enjoy that I make and they all look forward to it every year. For me, it's pork jerky. That might not work for you because you need a dehydrator but I can post the recipe if you want. It's a lot of work so no one ever makes it, but when they receive it for Christmas they know I put a lot of time and love in and I really think that's what Christmas should be about. It's really cheap... Mostly two or three large pork loins covers my entire Christmas list.

Other family members have started to do the same. My brother makes really good homemade caramel popcorn. My sister made some rum infusion to give out. Another sister even one time even made Dominoes somehow with resin.

If you are able to find time and energy to spread your love for your family and friends Christmas is a lot of fun.

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[–] interceder270@lemmy.world 12 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Dang, I was just thinking about how my mom got a raise years ago when I was still a kid and it practically changed our life. All of a sudden we were eating out more. All of a sudden we had nicer things. All of a sudden my mom wasn't stressed anymore.

It's sad to see how people are now experiencing the opposite of that. It's sad they're experiencing that when, in absolute terms, we are more productive than ever.

Greed really is the worst thing we face as a species in the modern age. It's a shame so many people are gung-ho about supporting it.

The disparity in wealth needs to shrink instead of grow. Otherwise, these problems will only get worse over time.

[–] Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 91 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Corporate profits ≠ my wallet

[–] MelodiousFunk@kbin.social 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Corporate profits <- your wallet

[–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 85 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Because it's a bullshit narrative. Cost of living keeps going up. But inflation doesn't count rent, groceries, or gas.

[–] Frozengyro@lemmy.world 18 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

For what it's worth gas has come down quite a bit the last few weeks.

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[–] interceder270@lemmy.world 17 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (5 children)

Rent is going to go up as long as it's able.

As soon as people have more money to spend, landlords increase rent.

Renting is one of the biggest scams this generation has convinced itself into falling for.

[–] jordanlund@lemmy.world 35 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I wasn't able to afford to buy a house until I was over 50 years old, it took a global pandemic, a complete shutdown of the economy, and working from home for multiple years to bank the cash to make it happen.

People don't rent because they CHOOSE to.

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[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 20 points 9 months ago (3 children)

lol yeah dude, I convinced myself to rent

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[–] TheControlled@lemmy.world 19 points 9 months ago (3 children)

This generation? Fucking Romans were complaining about high rent for shitty apartments over 2000 years ago. Don't be a dumbass.

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[–] Anamnesis@lemmy.world 17 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (6 children)

slaps forehead wait I can just buy a house? What a solution!! So easy!

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[–] jordanlund@lemmy.world 54 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Because interest rates are insane trapping people in homes they no longer want but can't afford to leave?

Speaking of... My car got totalled at the end of October, shopping for a new one, I saw interest rates for me between 7 and 8%, for other folks, I saw one as high as 12.25%(!) On a CAR LOAN.

[–] MelodiousFunk@kbin.social 20 points 9 months ago

Because interest rates are insane trapping people in homes they no longer want but can’t afford to leave?

I'm in this comment and I don't like it.

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[–] hark@lemmy.world 52 points 9 months ago (2 children)

"Why Americans feel gloomy about the economy despite paying a lot more for things than the official inflation numbers claim and having a wage that isn't rising as high as official numbers claim"

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[–] TheaoneAndOnly27@kbin.social 52 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

For Christmas dinner I vote we just eat the fucking rich

[–] douglasg14b@lemmy.world 17 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I agree, but we gotta be more thoughtful about it.

I recently had a crazy interaction where I was apparently "The Rich" that needs eaten because I landed a job with a good salary.

Working people aren't the enemy, needs to be made clear as well. Hell, even corporate headwigs raking in a few million aren't even close to your enemy in this regard either.

[–] bobs_monkey@lemm.ee 13 points 9 months ago

Sounds like jealousy honestly. I've had a couple conversations here in the past that because I went out and started my own electrical contracting business instead of working for someone that all of a sudden in the bourgeoise. Like, dude, why in the hell would I keep myself in a position of struggling when I have the skillset and knowledge to make a lot more money, though I'm in a small tourist town so it's not like I have a bunch of commercial contracts. I have one employee, who makes damn good money for an apprentice. I don't have health insurance because I can't fucking afford it without being back in the poor house. I ain't affording a house anytime soon, and my rent is $2k/month. Most of my gains for this year are going to be diminished because I have to buy a new truck to replace my old car with almost 200k miles on it, and interest rates are fucked. And then taxes take the rest because this country hates people striking out on their own. I make just enough to be slightly ahead of myself year over year, but my wife and I aren't on a beach in Bora Bora eating bons bons.

Point is, people are angry, and I get it, I'm pretty irritated too. But don't let people drag you down for your successes just because they're subscribing to the crabs in a bucket mentality.

[–] fender_symphonic584@lemmy.world 46 points 9 months ago (9 children)

"falling inflation" means prices are still rising...the rate of increase is what has decreased. What we need is negative inflation...or said differently, price decrease.

[–] frezik@midwest.social 21 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

You don't actually want that. It encourages people to "invest" by sticking hard cash in a mattress. It rewards people for doing absolutely nothing but taking money out of the economy.

Ideal (if we're keeping a monetary exchange society, anyway) is low (<3%), predictable inflation combined with wages increasing in proportion to productivity. We had a period of relatively low inflation followed by a giant spike, plus wage gains that are nowhere near matching productivity gains over the last 50 years, and that's where things hurt. Capitalism doesn't seem capable of this, however, as it's always chasing the next hype cycle that leads to these spikes and lulls.

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[–] HerrBeter@lemmy.world 19 points 9 months ago (6 children)

Deflation means stagnation or crash in economic terms

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[–] Bonskreeskreeskree@lemmy.world 16 points 9 months ago (8 children)

What you are describing is deflation and it's only happened twice during the history of the United States. It is also generally looked at as a bad thing.

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[–] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 42 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I can't remember the last time people felt good about the economy.

[–] negativeyoda@lemmy.world 12 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I can... but I was born in the 70s

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[–] calypsopub@lemmy.world 37 points 9 months ago (1 children)

My son graduated with a degree in economics in 2020 and still hasn't found a job. He's not counted in the unemployment numbers because he hasn't filed for benefits. We need to look at labor participation as well as underemployment instead of the useless stats being used in this article. Real wages have tanked. People are running up debt just to buy groceries. It's desperate out there.

[–] n2burns@lemmy.ca 14 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

He’s not counted in the unemployment numbers because he hasn’t filed for benefits.

That's untrue. From the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics:

In the Current Population Survey, people are classified as unemployed if they meet all of the following criteria:

  • They were not employed during the survey reference week.
  • They were available for work during the survey reference week, except for temporary illness.
  • They made at least one specific, active effort to find a job during the 4-week period ending with the survey reference week (see active job search methods) OR they were temporarily laid off and expecting to be recalled to their job.

There are other statistics measuring unemployment claims, but when you hear, "the unemployment rate for Oct 2023 is 3.9%", that is unrelated to benefits.

[–] finkrat@lemmy.world 36 points 9 months ago

Doesn't take a genius to figure out that when the economy restabilizes, that doesn't mean the cost of consumer goods go down or wages go up, it just means the billionaires running the show aren't losing millions

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 34 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Someone feel free to explain these two simultaneous headlines-

[–] Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social 34 points 9 months ago (1 children)

People who feel bad buy things to feel better. They might not be able to afford a new house or a car or medical care, but they’ll spend something on gifts.

Also, maybe it’s members of the owning class buying things. They’re getting more money all the time, whether the economy does “good” or not. So they’ve always got money to blow on shit.

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[–] halfempty@kbin.social 33 points 9 months ago

Maybe it's because everyone is struggling with high costs of housing, food, and healthcare, among other things, while wages have remained flat and stagnant for decades.

[–] lolola@lemmy.blahaj.zone 31 points 9 months ago (2 children)

I really wish news outlets would stop pretending this is some big mystery. Shit is too expensive.

[–] linearchaos@lemmy.world 24 points 9 months ago

IMO it's the inverse, we don't make enough. The 1% have been keeping wages stagnant. We can't stop the price of goods from going up, but we can increase pay from it sharing the bottom line. As soon as interest rates re-appeared, all the free money that was sitting around for the taking disappeared. Sooner than later, we'll be paying micro-transactions for crap that was previously able to be paid for by selling us ads. But that money isn't coming back to us.

[–] Patches@sh.itjust.works 20 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.

  • Upton Sinclair, 1934
[–] dangblingus@lemmy.world 27 points 9 months ago

The unemployment is low because people have a gun to their head. Inflation is falling, but it's not zero, therefore everything is still getting more expensive.

eCoNoMiCs.

[–] rayyy@lemmy.world 26 points 9 months ago

"most prices are high and still rising" Pretty obvious that corporations are price gouging to get their friendly fascist lifetime dictator back in power.

[–] SuiXi3D@kbin.social 25 points 9 months ago (4 children)

My wife and I are making more money than we ever have in the past. However, before that I was unemployed and was forced to find some way to keep being able to buy groceries, gas for the car, and helping my wife pay bills. As such, the only way I saw to do so was to take out a credit card or two, and they quickly got maxed out. So now I’m stuck paying $700/month in credit card bills, as well as dealing with the increasing food and rent prices. Our bills take a larger percentage of our total wages than before. And sure, part of that’s my own fault, but at the time it was do what I did or starve and get evicted. I wasn’t about to let that happen to my wife.

We’re still able to survive, but it’s by the skin of our teeth.

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[–] IamRoot@sh.itjust.works 24 points 9 months ago (1 children)

$4 for a bag of potato chips.

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[–] YeetPics@mander.xyz 14 points 9 months ago (8 children)

Oh boy inflation is falling.

Unless it's greedy C-level execs falling out of windows there won't be a change in the cost. The issue is greed, inflation was just the scapegoat.

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