I'm so very confused by this situation. For those who are against supporting Israel. Can you explain to me rationally why you think Hamas doesn't deserve to be wiped out after Oct 7th? I'm not denying the civilian casualties I agree it is unacceptably high But that doesn't caragotize what's happening as a genocide. But Hamas has said they want a high casualty rate they are using their civilians as human shields. Would you really suggest Hamas should just be able to get away with Oct 7th because they are hiding behind their people. Like what is your answer if you were the one making the choice here? Please I know this is an inflammatory topic but I promise I'm only trying to understand your opinion on the matter.
this post was submitted on 15 May 2024
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Can you explain to me rationally why you think Hamas doesn’t deserve to be wiped out after Oct 7th?
...
You want me to explain why a foreign government shouldn't be "wiped out" for a war crime?
By that logic, why shouldn't Israel's government be "wiped out" for the attacks on civilians leading up to it?
Or at least for their actions after it where they killed 10x more civilians and destroyed billions in infrastructure?
And that's not even getting into how Israels government draws no distinction from someone who lives and Gaza and belongs to Hamas.
Your logic just doesn't seem to be consistent, and you're focusing on the one time Hamas did anything comparable to how Israel has treated Palestinian civilians over 70 years...
Burning babies in their cribs and slaughtering mothers in front of daughters is not a valid form of protest.
So why didn't we do anything when Israel is doing even worse?
Literally, right now they're doing worse to a lot more people...
And before 10/7, they were still doing worse to even more people...
So why focus on that one day and ignore literally everything else?
Like, you realize the people from Hamas on 10/7 are the families of Israels prior victims?
If Israel is justified in what they're doing because of 10/7, why wasn't 10/7 justified?
If none of it is acceptable, why are you only focusing on the one day Israel's were the victim over every other day they were the attackers?
Sure, so you want to treat this conflict like it didn't start on 10/7. Ok.
Do you believe that the 20 year campaign of suicide bombing perpetrated by Palestinian militants was a valid form of protest? Did you grow up seeing the charred skeletons of buses on TV? Did you know that this terror campaign was so vicious that Israel had to forcibly relocate Jews that had lived in Gaza their entire lives, who's families had lived in Gaza for generations? Would you define this as ethnic cleansing by Palestinians?
Do you believe that the Yom Kippur war surprise attack was a valid form of protest? Did you know that the Arab countries position was to refuse any peace deal with Israel, even when they were offered the return of the Sinai and the Golan?
If you think that Israel has a responsibility to ensure aid enters Gaza, then surely you believe that closing the Suez to Israeli shipping was a casus belli for the 6 day war?
Do you believe the attempted genocide of Jews by their Arab neighbors in 1948 was a valid form of protest? Do you think that Arabs have the right to enforce a racially pure population? Have you thought about why 20 percent of Israelis are Arab? Is it possible that these were honest folks who did not attempt to commit a genocide against Jews?
Have you stopped to think why Jews, who have existed in the area for thousands of years, no longer have extant populations in Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Yemen, or Iraq? Have you considered the possibility that they were ethnically cleansed by their Arab neighbors? Have you heard of the Farhud? Do you have any idea what you're talking about?
Edit: the instant downvote without any rebuttal demonstrates how inconvenient the truth is pro-Hamas supporters.
Only the desperate do suicide attacks. It's sad that they even have to resort to such things. They weren't militants. I heard some of them were young adults who had nothing else to live for.
They couldn't attack anyone if their land wasn't stolen.
Jews still exist in Iraq. Israel pretended to be Arab terrorists and tried to trick them into becoming Israelis. It didn't work. Israelis allies made Yemen HELL for everyone. That's when Israel capitalized and took in Yemeni Jews. Israel absorbed the Levantine Jews.
France helped with the Suez Canal thing. They knew they will betray Egypt. Israel's creation was a giant backstapping. At every step.
I know you drunk the koolaid as soon as you mentioned Arabs have cleansed the area of Jews. The real truth is the Arab culture absorbed everyone in the region. The Philistines, Judahites, Isrealites, Arameans, Lihyanites, etc. You clearly have been forced fed lies and propaganda your whole life.
Also, stop crying about down votes when talking about a sensitive issue. Are you really going to break down every time the rain of lies that makes up your upbringing gets challenged?
Wow not even trying to hide the Nazi ideology anymore with the "stab in the back" rhetoric? Real mask off moment.
In 1947 there were 156,000 Jews living in Iraq. Today there are three. Just like #Pallywood, you lie through your teeth.
You spout this nonsense about false flag attacks yet provide no proof. This is the exact same nonsense as Kristallnacht. Funny enough, the Arab world embraced Nazism whole cloth. "Religion of peace".
You say that the land in Israel was stolen. You also say that Yemeni Jews were forced to relocate to Israel. How are both possible? The amount of mental gymnastics to try to rationalize the pro Hamas position is insanity.
Wow, I did not reliaze there was an Israeli operation to also move all of the Iraqi Jews to Israel. So, Israeli has now relocated all Arab Jews which lasted till... the formation of Israel. Where is this Arab cleansing? The Israelis cleansed the Arab lands of its Jews.
You say that the land in Israel was stolen. You also say that Yemeni Jews were forced to relocate to Israel. How are both possible?
What is the conflict here?
Did you know Germany had to make an official statement to correct Isreal. Israel tried to blame the Holocaust on the "Sharif of Jerusalem." Germany said (about a month ago), "No, that was us."
Massive victim blaming. "We didn't ethnically cleanse them, we just slaughtered them by the thousands, banned their religion and them owning property. They left on their own!"
I'm not surprised someone defending Hamas is ready to blame the victim. That whole side of the world has a pretty bad track record on women's rights.
I'm not defending Hamas. I'm noting that Arab Jews existed until Israel had operations to absorb them.
“We didn’t ethnically cleanse them, we just slaughtered them by the thousands, banned their religion and them owning property. They left on their own!”
Is this an IDF quote from Gaza? Is this about the auctioned land?
Sure, so you want to treat this conflict like it didn’t start on 10/7. Ok.
I don't know why a logical peraon wouldn't...
Or why I should continue conversations with people who do
Yes I want you to explain how the extreme brutality of what Hamas soldiers did on Oct 7th compares to Israel relating. Have you watched the videos? I'm not denying the treatment of Palestine citizens by Israel but that does not give Hamas the right to do what they did on Oct 7th. Again watch the videos Hamas themselves recorded during the attack. They killed those people because their religion told them to. Hamas themselves said they will keep doing it again and again. I understand the death toll is high. But again what would you rather do? I'm just trying to understand your logic. I don't know how to wage war but I can take an educated guess that it's pretty difficult to tell the difference between a Gaza citizen and a Hamas solders as they don't wear any kind of uniform and purposely hide amongst civilians. I'm not defending killing civilians in asking what your alternative strategy would be. Or how you think Israel and us should respond. Because zero response is an unacceptable answer.
...
So why aren't you calling for Israel's government to be wiped out when they've spent decades killing way more civilians?
I don't think you understand that part.
If you think that should happen to Hamas, but not Israel's government.
Then you're just saying Palestinians have no human rights but Israelis do.
Like, you're mad at someone punching back, but not the person who spent decades punching first.
Well if I'm being honest from what I know it sure doesn't seem like Israel punched first. Can you educate me in what you mean by killing more civilians? Like are you talking about similar retaliatory attacks killing civilians more civilians. Because currently I understand why is Israel is killing more civilians. I'm not arguing it's right. I don't think there is a right answer here. I do think the context of the attacks matters. Hamas has stated very clearly they intend on perpetrating Oct 7th again and again. Jews being in their holy land is literally against their religion they have said this repeatedly. You can ask a Hamas solder why he's fighting and he will tell you this. Can you provide an alternative to what Israel is doing? I've asked several times. I wish I had an answer.
Here's an example from 2021
But you keep saying you have no knowledge on this subject at all...
You shouldn't be asking for random social media accounts to explain shit like this.
Like, is this really how you think it's best to learn about geopolitics?
Asking strangers online?
It's not like this is some crazy niche.
It's just hard for me to believe you're sincerely asking these questions and are so opinionated that Israel is in the right. I'm not responding anymore.
Biden loyalists still believe they are the good guys. I am pretty sure, when Julius Caesar marched into Gaul, that the Roman army thought of themselves as bad guys... We know where Biden supporters stand. Did the Nazis believe they were the bad guys? Government psy-ops a success on a huge segment of the population.
Got it, voting trump instead. He'll stop the genocide.
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Why are you so sure no amount of pressure from voters will ever make Biden stop funding a genocide?
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Do you believe he's like this about everything or just the genocide of brown people?
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Why do you support a candidate for the Dem nomination who doesn't listen to the people he needs votes from?
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It might but it better happen fast if he wants to gain back any protest votes.
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Fuck if I know. It's tradition at this point. How far in us president history do we have to go to find a president that didn't kill a bunch of brown people?
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I don't support biden. I'll give him credit for the good shit he did but I'm voting for him to avoid the US becoming a theocratic fascist state... Faster than it already is at least.
Oh yes, because Christianity is so evil, it proliferated compassion across the world. It ended slavery, created Just War Theory (a moral approach to war), proliferated the concept of human rights It culturally ingrained into its followers the concept of secularism, and egalitarianism. How far the democrat party has fallen. They fear the Bible and Orange Man so much, genocide is an acceptable trade-off. You must really hate Jesus.
Oh yes, because Christianity is so evil,
It is...
it proliferated compassion across the world
It didn't...
It ended slavery
The Bible is pro slavery...
created Just War Theory (a moral approach to war),
Lol
proliferated the concept of human rights
It supports fucking slavery and says a wife is a husband property, and sexual acts unless for reproduction is a sin and should be illegal...
I'm not going to keep going, because I haven't hit a truthful thing you've said yet.
but I’m voting for him to avoid the US becoming a theocratic fascist state…
It's not avoiding it, it's making it happen slower.
I think you've forgotten how religious Biden is and how much he's talked about that influencing his positions.
Why do you think he's essentially ignored Roe V Wade being overturned? He doesn't want abortion to be legal due to his religious views.
He did an executive order, but it accomplished nothing. And that was just because midterms were coming.
And the way he's encouraging cops to go after peaceful protesters?
He's saying the same bullshit about protesters trump said about BLM protesters.
Biden isn't against fascism, he's against the other team being in charge of it.
That's what happens when one side turns the fascism up to 11, and the only other option is obsessed with meeting them half way.
The best result is slightly more than half fascist.
And that hurts turnout, and low turnout is when the fascists win.
The best way to stop the fascists, is to fight them, not compromise with them. That shit doesn't work.
Are these motherfuckers TRYING to lose the election and thus democracy to a fascist conman?! 🤦
Genocide Joe is a fascist con-man. Anyone defending this is a hardcore tankie.
Correct, Joe Biden is the fascist here.
In a democracy, you can vote for whichever fascist party you like
They only want your loyalty.
Trump's the best thing to happen to Biden. He has a blank check to do whatever he likes, knowing full well the only response is "Trump will be worse"
So. do you think Netanyahu pinched his nose or something. you know. while biden was sucking his dick off? "withhold weapons, are you...?"
it'd be nice if one of the most powerful men in the world actually had a fucking spine.
They have the spine to laugh at all the peasants below them, i think it's someone else lacking spine
Weekly Biden gaslighting complete, quick ship some $700m in tank shells they ran out shooting at tent camps in Rafah!
The package disclosed Tuesday includes about $700 million for tank ammunition, $500 million in tactical vehicles and $60 million in mortar rounds, the congressional aides said. They spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss an arms transfer that has not yet been made public.
So that's 1.36 Billion.
Jesus tapdancing christ he just can’t fucking help scoring an own-goal. What the actual fuck.
I’ve been trying to be as magnanimous and politically pragmatic as I can, but this is straight up idiotic. Come the fuck on, Biden. You are going to throw the whole fucking election if you keep this up.
I don't think he cares
I think he kinda does, but at the same time he’s too fucking old and set in his boomer ways. I’m beginning to suspect that he may be incapable of understanding why the youths can’t just sEe tHinGs hiS WaY.
he doesn't care as long as progressives lose, he doesn't care whether biden or trump wins
wtf are you talking about
I am shocked Biden went back on his word so quickly...
/s