this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2024

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221

France's 90-day visa hell as Brits forced to sell their homes over EU rules (www.express.co.uk)

submitted 7 months ago by stopthatgirl7@kbin.social to c/news@lemmy.world

64 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Non-EU citizens can only spend a total of 90 days over an 180-day period in the whole of the European Union.

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[–] PhobosAnomaly@feddit.uk 102 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (3 children)

Firstly, fuck the Express and fuck that site in particular, turned my phone's screen into Times Square.

While the article doesn't mention their 2016 voting, I'd love to see a Venn diagram of those who had the means and bought property in the EU, and those who had voted to leave. I suspect they'd not be far off a circle.

I feel genuinely sorry for the outliers (edit: assumed outliers) who believed in the EU's ideals and wanted property for whatever reason - work, family, whatever - and are getting horsed by the Blue Passport Gang.

Anecdotally, a good friend of mine has British parents who moved to northern France, voted to leave, and are now shocked that new and harsher rules could possibly apply to them. The most frustrating part is that they're absolutely blind to the prospect that they might just have pissed on their own chips. It's genuinely saddening to see people put two and two together, and come up with "someone else's fault".

[–] SonnyVabitch@lemmy.world 41 points 7 months ago

English exceptionalism is a disease that ails British society. People are shocked that the French etc. would apply reciprocal rules on Brits although in their minds it's perfectly legitimate to apply harsh immigration policies to people wanting to come to the UK. They genuinely don't understand it, and it's tragic in a way.

[–] zurohki@aussie.zone 37 points 7 months ago (1 children)

they might just have pissed on their own chips

This might be the most British thing I've ever heard.

[–] Pretzilla@lemmy.world 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

They voluntarily sprinkle vinegar on them so why not

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[–] Weslee@lemmy.world 24 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Lives in France, votes to leave the EU, fuck sake, these Brexit dummies make me ashamed to be English. Thanks for fucking over the rest of the country with your stupidity!

[–] jpeps@lemmy.world 12 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I genuinely can't understand it, like I can't even come up with a single plausible way these people could think this way. How could you live in France, in the EU, intend to continue to live there because you obviously like it, and think that your home country needs to do something different?

[–] Aceticon@lemmy.world 6 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

As somebody else pointed out above; "British exceptionalism".

I was living in Britain at the time of the Leave vote and the vast majority of the Leave "arguments" were anchored in some way or other on the idea that Britons and Britain would get special treatment because of being who they are (remember the whole "German car manufacturers will make sure we have a good deal to keep access to the UK market" argument?).

Also I'm from a very touristic country and it's pretty easy to notice the feeling of superiority of lots of Britons when they come here, especially old people.

(The funny bit its that I ended up in England after years in The Netherlands, so ended up with Northern European standards and hence was less than impressed by Britain by the time I got there in 2006)

Anyways, all this to say that it's absolutelly believable that lots, maybe even most, of those older people who lived abroad after retiring (so never really integrated in the local society, as people actually working there would) did genuinelly believe the idea that Britons would get special treatment. I mean, here in Portugal they're not especially well integrated but especially the stories from the Costas in Spain is of pretty much self-contained Little-England communities, english-speaking and with their own stores and everything, all filled with British retirees most of whom never go into the trouble of learning even the most basic Spanish.

[–] jpeps@lemmy.world 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

That's fair, thanks for your well thought out comment. I imagine most Europeans knowing your language can create a feeling of superiority.

The brexit arguments were pretty broad as well in terms of what the EU would do for us, so I suppose there may have been a pipe dream of maintaining the right to travel and remain. Ugh I don't think I will ever not be angry about the outcome.

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[–] SonnyVabitch@lemmy.world 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

some Remainer arguments were also of the British Exceptionalist kind. Specifically the whole idea of "We should stay in the EU and change it from the inside" also reeks of "we know best" and "the EU will change to accomodate us".

To be fair, while it comes across as snotty arrogance, the idea of negotiating with the other member states to steer the Union in your favour is a power and responsibility of every member state.

[–] Aceticon@lemmy.world 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

The British relationship with the rest of the EU was, at least by the time I moved to Britain (so, 2006), adversarial (win-loose) rather than cooperative (win-win), the latter being more common in the rest of Europe, especially smaller nations.

Also keep in mind that this was following Cammeron's demands for Britain to be allowed to limit Free Movement from the rest of the EU into Britain but not the other way around (i.e. Britons still kept that right, just stopped reciprocating it) "or else we'll have a Referendum on leaving the EU", which was what triggered the Leave Referendum, so “We should stay in the EU and change it from the inside” back then as justification to Remain rather than Leave sure sounded a lot like suggesting that the objective of priviledged treatment for Britons over the rest should be better pursued inside the EU.

It certainly didn't came across as an appeal to it being better to carry on cooperating for the common good that to leave, which would be the kind of thing more likely to sway, say the Dutch or the Portuguese.

I suspect you might be confusing a local cultural artifact you see all around you in British Modern Culture with a general way of behaving in Europe: everybody is selfish to some point, but from the countries in Europe I lived in, Britain was the one were selfishness and adversarial approaches (you have to win, otherwise that mean you lose) were the most common and accepted. IMHO, Britain is in this in the middle between Continental Europe and the US.

[–] sparky@lemmy.federate.cc 90 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

Articles like this are so disingenuous. UK news has been reporting things like this for several years now, always trying to make it sound like it’s us mean old continental Europeans who are forcing our evil rules on the poor blameless Britons. As opposed to being the exact thing they themselves voted for. Hello and fuck you from sunny Portugal, dear Brexit voters!

[–] butterflyattack@lemmy.world 88 points 7 months ago (2 children)

As a British person who spent several years living and working in EU countries before brexit and is now unable to - I don't think I'll ever stop being furious at the ignorant bigoted fucks who voted away the wonderful freedom of movement we shared with our neighbours. Useless slack-jawed gibbering wankers.

[–] Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world 29 points 7 months ago (2 children)

You have been permanently banned from c/Conservative.

[–] Archer@lemmy.world 9 points 7 months ago (2 children)

So disappointed if that’s real and they followed us from Reddit

[–] stoly@lemmy.world 3 points 7 months ago

This is going to be very much an instance-dependent thing.

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[–] stoly@lemmy.world 7 points 7 months ago

LOL I actually had someone do that to me on Reddit. Saw some random post of mine they didn't like and permanently banned me from a sub I never once heard of.

[–] sparky@lemmy.federate.cc 2 points 7 months ago

I am genuinely sorry you have been fucked over ☹️

[–] bitwaba@lemmy.world 3 points 7 months ago (4 children)

I don't think it was the British people with French homes that voted for brexit...

[–] Tippon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 23 points 7 months ago (1 children)

You'd be surprised.

I personally know a guy who lives in Spain and owns a house in France, and he voted for Brexit. The stupidity here is ridiculous.

[–] robocall@lemmy.world 3 points 7 months ago (1 children)

What did the pro brexit British people think they were voting for?

[–] Tippon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 7 months ago

They unironically voted to stop foreigners from moving to 'their' country...

[–] Cheradenine@sh.itjust.works 13 points 7 months ago

I personally know of two couples who did this. It's totally Leopards ate my face shit

[–] stoly@lemmy.world 8 points 7 months ago

Spain did this first and most certainly idiots living in Spain voted against their own needs because they really didn't think that there would be consequences.

[–] leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 7 months ago

It absolutely was.

[–] Clbull@lemmy.world 82 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

Britain: "Screw the EU. We're sick of following your regulations and welcoming your people into our country just to steal our jobs from hardworking British workers and scrounge off of our NHS and welfare state. But we still want to trade freely and come live in your countries whenever we feel like it, because we're massive xenophobic hypocrites who think the entire world still revolves around us."

France: "Fruckoff."

[–] beebarfbadger@lemmy.world 19 points 7 months ago

"We don't wanna be in the EU anymore!"

"Okay, then you'll be treated like people who aren't in the EU anymore."

"No, wait..."

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 53 points 7 months ago

Wait, there are consequences to Brexit and things have changed?!

[–] Reddfugee42@lemmy.world 51 points 7 months ago (1 children)

[–] SonnyVabitch@lemmy.world 10 points 7 months ago

I'm no ornithologist but I don't think that's a peacock.

[–] Newtra@pawb.social 43 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Saying goodbye to their life in France, where they were paying around £2,574 (€3,000) in taxes every year,

So these people who were rich enough to own a second home wanted to spend more than 50% of their time in France, but were paying the vast majority of their taxes back to the UK?

No wonder the laws got tightened.

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[–] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 41 points 7 months ago

[–] JeeBaiChow@lemmy.world 37 points 7 months ago

'And I would've gotten away with it too, ecxept for those meddling consequences!'

[–] Radicaldog@lemmy.world 32 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Man, this thread is full of dickheads. Even if, say, only 30% of these people voted Remain, that's a lot of people who deserve some sympathy. To damn a whole group of people when a substantial number share the exact same opinions as you is truly thoughtless.

I'm a remainer in a leave-majority area, for what it's worth. May as well tell me about the "consequences of my actions" too!

[–] stoly@lemmy.world 23 points 7 months ago (1 children)

You can feel sorry for roughly 45% of the state of TX while still staying clear of that shithole.

[–] Halosheep@lemm.ee 7 points 7 months ago

As a Texan, I understand...

[–] elbarto777@lemmy.world 6 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (4 children)

No sympathy for deliberate stupidity and pride-based sense of entitlement.

Edit: I misread OP's comment. Yeah, for those who voted Remain, geez, sucks to be you, and I understand (source: Did not want Trump to win.)

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[–] stoly@lemmy.world 30 points 7 months ago

If this is anything like what happened in Spain, then they had every opportunity to change their status and avoid any issues.

[–] CodeName@infosec.pub 25 points 7 months ago

Oh no, somehow they no longer hold the rights and privileges of being a part of the EU!!! What evil monsters did that to them?

[–] moitoi@feddit.de 21 points 7 months ago (1 children)

A substantial part of them applied for French citizenship after Brexit. If they received it, these are fine.

It's funny to see the others crying over it.

[–] tal@lemmy.today 11 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

Over here in the US, a bunch of Central American countries offer retirement visas, aiming at the American retiree market. Less-expensive, warm weather.

https://money.usnews.com/money/retirement/aging/articles/countries-that-offer-retirement-visas

8 Countries That Offer Retirement Visas

These countries welcome American retirees with special programs and benefits.

Countries around the world are looking to attract American retirees. Some countries have created visa policies specifically designed for retirees and in some cases offer special benefits and incentives for relocating. The most attractive retirement visas are usually found in Latin America, although a few Asian countries also offer appealing programs.

Back when Brexit was being figured out, I remember seeing a lot of discussion about retired Brits living in Spain being unhappy about not knowing what was going on. I commented a few times on how if Spain didn't run a retirement visa program, they might consider doing so; it sounded like a lot of elderly Brits liked living in Spain.

[–] Schmuppes@lemmy.world 11 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

they might consider doing so; it sounded like a lot of elderly Brits liked living in Spain.

Yeah but the question is, did the Spaniards like a lot of elderly Brits living in Spain? I can see them not bending over backwards for a clientele that may well have had a bad influence on local housing and cost of living ;)

[–] stoly@lemmy.world 2 points 7 months ago

I do think that this is what happened in a lot of contexts. Decades of people traveling abroad and making a bad name for their country finally caught up.

[–] stoly@lemmy.world 3 points 7 months ago

For Argentina, you just need to earn at least $500/month from a government-funded retirement (i.e. Social Security) of any sort and they'll pretty much just give you a pensioner's visa.

[–] spriteblood@kbin.social 19 points 7 months ago

Alternative headline:

"Brits F**k Around, Find Out"

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