this post was submitted on 14 Nov 2023
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[–] cobysev@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Depends on what you want out of it. Are you looking for exercise, self-defense skills, how to disable someone with practically no effort, looking to impress someone with some "ninja moves," etc.?

When I was stationed in Japan 20 years ago, I found a martial arts course taught at our base's gym. Ninpo Budo Tai Jitsu. I had never heard of it before, but they were offering a free month before you had to start paying for classes, so I figured I'd check it out.

Turns out, it's not a self-defense course like I thought. It's an assassination art. They said the goal was to kill your opponent as quickly as possible, before they had a chance to kill you. They made a point to say that we weren't allowed to practice our training on each other or spar with each other, in case we accidentally killed someone.

Suffice to say, I dropped the course after my free month and signed up at a nearby Karate dojo. That was much more my style. It's probably the most basic of martial arts. Gives you good exercise, some self-defense skills, and mental focus.

Definitely research different art forms and decide for yourself which works best for you. I've sampled a bunch over the years, but I think Aikido spoke to me personally now than any other form.

[–] IonAddis@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I'm sorry, I'm just laughing over the idea of some dude accidentally signing up for classes in assassination. I can believe it happened--but it'd also make a great story.

Make it so the guy is too timid to stop going (maybe because he was taking martial arts as a way to learn assertiveness) and you have a book or TV series about an accidental assassin.

[–] bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de 2 points 10 months ago

"That time I accidentally signed up for assassination classes"

[–] spittingimage@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

There's been some big changes in that style. The most extreme stuff got removed from the curriculum. I once got a look at a manual from the 70s, and yes - there was some disturbing eye stuff.

[–] leaky_shower_thought@feddit.nl 1 points 10 months ago

Hmmm. that art name is cool, but I think I am with you on going for a more "general" art with karate do or Aikido.

Some arts are too specialized that you can't enjoy or appreciate it for day-to-days.

[–] LegionEris@feddit.nl 12 points 10 months ago

Teacher>art

And the best martial art for self defense is track

[–] Clbull@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Depends.

For self-defence, you can't really go wrong with any serious martial art though krav maga is really effective against untrained combatants if you have to fight, but in other situations where you can flee, the 100M sprint is best to ensure your survival. Krav maga is otherwise not recommended because it teaches a lot of techniques that are illegal in MMA.

For MMA, it's best to go with wrestling, judo or brazilian jiu jitsu as grapping martial arts, and muay thai (a superior Thai form of kickboxing) as a striking martial art. Boxing can work but you'll be limited to just punches. Other martial arts are inferior for their own reasons.

[–] dotslashme@infosec.pub 9 points 10 months ago

The one that inspires and keeps you engaged.

[–] Brawndo@kbin.social 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The school of Anything Goes Martial Arts!

[–] PullUpCircuit@iusearchlinux.fyi 3 points 10 months ago

Plus side is actual strong techniques.

Downside is irresponsible teachers, dangerous teaching practices and literal body dismorphia.

[–] HeneryHawk@thelemmy.club 6 points 10 months ago (2 children)

If you could only be an expert in one and average at the rest, it's wrestling because of the ability you would have to control your opponent. If I could pick a second it would be Mauy Thai as striking is obviously important

[–] natecox@programming.dev 2 points 10 months ago

I have a black belt in a mixed martial art focused on self defense in the real world, of which one of the primary pillars is “never be on the ground”.

Wrestling is excellent for subduing a single opponent, but is not suited for dealing with multiple attackers. You can be the world’s greatest wrestler and perfectly lock your opponent out, but it doesn’t help you when his buddy comes and kicks you in the back of your head.

We assume that in any self defense encounter you will need to defend yourself against more than one person.

[–] AtmaJnana@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

As a former wrestler who also did some kung fu, I mostly agree. The only styles I'd generally have more trouble with (against someone of comparable skill) are ones where they focus on grappling ,throws, and floor moves. Especially jujitsu, but also judo and aikido.

[–] Nemo@midwest.social 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Swordfighting, because it looks super cool.

[–] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

HEMA is fun as hell, because you get to hit people with swords/staves/axes and not hold back.

HEMA can also be rather unfun, because people get to hit you with swords, and while the armor and helmets are good, they're also expensive and don't last forever. They also don't cover everything, and don't do much against wrestling moves.

But you get to hit people with swords

[–] sntx@lemm.ee 2 points 10 months ago
[–] jedi@lemm.ee 4 points 10 months ago

What is best? Best for physical exercise? Best for real world fighting?

[–] meco03211@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The best self defense technique is only taught through one school. It has been referred to by different names over the millenia though. The crazy thing is, it is super simple and easy to pick up. Of course I'm referring to the ancient art of Run-fu (or Run Foo!). It has also been called Tae-Kwan-Go or Jiu-Sprintsu.

In all seriousness though, what are you hoping to gain? All around self defense? Exercise? Train for a street fight with "rules" (like spectators will stand you up the moment it goes to the ground)?

[–] atocci@kbin.social 3 points 10 months ago

Joseph Joestar-ass school

[–] FunkyMonk@kbin.social 4 points 10 months ago

I got weinie arms and Tae Kwon Do was mostly kicking so I enjoyed it for that and just the stretching and general exercize.

[–] Joker@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

MMA. It’s interesting to go back and watch early UFC fights. The fighters back then specialized in one style so you would see these crazy matches like Tae-Kwon-Do versus a sumo wrestler or something. I remember a boxer going up against a BJJ fighter and getting his ass handed to him. There were some really lopsided matches with BJJ fighters or wrestlers.

Back then, they didn’t wear gloves and it was billed as “no holds barred”. I think the only rules were no biting or eye gouging. The matches were bonkers. There was one where some little dude was fighting a big guy and basically punched him in the balls like 20 times until he couldn’t stand.

Over the first couple dozen events, you can see the styles start to blend into what became modern MMA. The wrestlers were taking up boxing. The strikers were learning some ground skills. It was several events in when a boxer was demonstrating an ability to evade BJJ takedowns with a sprawl move.

Early MMA fights are the only thing I can think of where you can witness the evolution of a new martial art that’s practical and combat-tested. You see weaknesses in styles and fighters who respond by adding a new move. You see what works and then other fighters start copying. Eventually, it blends together into modern MMA.

[–] intensely_human@lemm.ee 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Your first mention seems to indicate the BJJ fighters won when matched with boxers.

But later you say wrestlers took up boxing, and that boxers demonstrated the about to avoid BJJ takedowns.

Am I reading that wrong? What was the typical outcome in BJJ vs boxer?

[–] Joker@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 10 months ago

The BJJ fighters beat the shit out of boxers. The first PPV event was insanity. It was like the Street Fighter video game in real life. It was a one day tournament where they kept fighting until there was a champion. Royce Gracie and Ken Shamrock were the only guys who could really do well against any other fighting style. Jim Brown was doing color commentary and was at a complete loss for words during the fight where some little karate dude repeatedly bashed his opponent's balls. It was absolute insanity.

Gracie was basically unbeatable and Shamrock was always in contention too. I think he won once or twice in the early years. Nobody knew how to deal with them because they would take opponents down and beat them on the ground. But I remember this one boxer dude came back a couple years later with a sprawl move. That was the first time I ever saw it in UFC. He was avoiding takedowns and getting strikes in. Most fighters were doing it not long after and the fighting really started to evolve. Then it became a mix of striking, takedowns and ground game. Even the BJJ and wrestling guys were forced to evolve.

[–] NumbersCanBeFun@kbin.social 3 points 10 months ago

I don’t consider it “real” martial arts but I learned MCMAP in the Marine Corps and a lot of those skills are very relevant for self defense and quickly disabling an opponent. The tan belt stuff isn’t great but if you go up in belts you learn a lot more and it gets really fun if you’re into it.

[–] magnetosphere@kbin.social 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

What’s you definition of “best” in this context? For serious, real-world ass kicking, I’d look into Krav Maga… but most of us aren’t mercenaries. If you’re looking for something more well rounded, FunkyMonk and qyron seem to have better suggestions.

[–] Rhinopotamus@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

I nearly searched “FunkyMonk, martial art” after reading your comment.

[–] qyron@sopuli.xyz 2 points 10 months ago

For the physical fitness, Muay Thai.

It is also effective for a self defense context, if the trainer teaches non-sport Muay Thai. Muay Thai is essentially street fighting.

For self control and development of balance, speed and coordenation, try Aikido.

[–] walter_wiggles@lemmy.nz 2 points 10 months ago

There are no "best" martial arts. What you will find is that each martial art style has some kind of figurehead who can demonstrate how effective it is, but in reality it's the fighter not the style that's effective.

[–] leaky_shower_thought@feddit.nl 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm all sold for strengthening and balance so a mix of wing chun and tai chi chuan for me.

Also "nigerundayo smokey" if I get some good constitution back.

[–] TomAwsm@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

Depends what you want from it. Self defense? Fitness? Coordination? General health? Discipline?

For self defense, which is what most people want, probably Krav Maga. AFAIK it's the only thing that's been developed purely for self defense.

[–] Encode1307@lemm.ee 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

20+ years of martial arts experience here and there's some terrible advice in here. Any martial art that doesn't have an active competition scene is garbage in terms of self defense. This includes krav maga, aikido, most types of kung fu (except sanda and shuai jiou). I spent half of those 20 years doing aikido and hapkido, and they were largely useless.

In the competitive martial arts, wrestling, judo, Brazilian Jiujitsu, Muay Thai, and boxing are the gold standards. Most MMA is a combination of those four and definitely the most effective. I don't like getting punched in the face so I stick with jiujitsu (brown belt). Karate is hit or miss, but some styles like kyokushin are really good.

I've been talking about self defense effectiveness. If you just want to get in shape, then pretty much anything that makes you sweat is going to work for that. Just don't do krav expecting to be a killer, no matter how much camo your instructor wears.

[–] Witchfire@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

What would you say are the best martial arts for a performer to learn? I've been wanting to pick up one or two just to borrow for my repertoires. The ideal is something that is flashy and "ok" for self defense (even if not the best).

[–] Encode1307@lemm.ee 2 points 10 months ago

Tae kwon do kicks are flashy and can look cool if done well. I think wushu looks amazing even if it's more dance than martial art.

[–] ExcursionInversion@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Aikido

Steven Seagal does it so it must be good

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Lol isn't that the one that revolves primarily around fake throws?

[–] qyron@sopuli.xyz 2 points 10 months ago

You can resist a throw, obviously, but the grabs and movements exploit phisiology.

One of the basic manouvres aplies pressure on the radial nerve and wrist, in a twist like motion. It is really painful and resisting it can cause serious damage.

The throws are defensive manouvers to avoid serious injuries.

[–] qyron@sopuli.xyz 2 points 10 months ago

What it takes to make it an hard martial art is often not taught, which rendered it as a watered version of itself.

Aikido does have a set of "attack" movements, used to break the offensive of the opponent.

[–] HipsterTenZero@dormi.zone -3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

MMA - the whole idea is to poach the good stuff from every other martial art and dump what sucks.

but the real answer is guns

[–] Bonehead@kbin.social 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

but the real answer is guns

Wrong. It's actually Gun-Fu.

And of course let's not forget this masterpiece of the style.

[–] Deceptichum@kbin.social 1 points 10 months ago

I’d like to see your gunfu vs my gun-kata