this post was submitted on 24 Jun 2024
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[–] ShaunaTheDead@fedia.io 251 points 4 months ago (12 children)

Reminds me of an early application of AI where scientists were training an AI to tell the difference between a wolf and a dog. It got really good at it in the training data, but it wasn't working correctly in actual application. So they got the AI to give them a heatmap of which pixels it was using more than any other to determine if a canine is a dog or a wolf and they discovered that the AI wasn't even looking at the animal, it was looking at the surrounding environment. If there was snow on the ground, it said "wolf", otherwise it said "dog".

[–] driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br 145 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (9 children)

Early chess engine that used AI, were trained by games of GMs, and the engine would go out of its way to sacrifice the queen, because when GMs do it, it's comes with a victory.

[–] papalonian@lemmy.world 36 points 4 months ago

Reg, why'd you just stab yourself in the shoulder?

Ah cmon, ain't ya ever seen a movie?

Well of course I've seen a movie, but what the hell are ya doing?

Every time the guy stabs himself in a movie, it's right before he kicks the piss outta the guy he's fightin'!

Well that don't.. when that happens, the guys gotta plan Reg, what the hell's your plan?

I dunno, but I'm gonna find out!

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[–] kandoh@reddthat.com 44 points 4 months ago (1 children)

That's funny because if I was trying to tell the difference between a wolf and a dog I would look for 'is it in the woods?' and 'how big is it relative to what's around it?'.

[–] Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 31 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

What about telling the difference between a wolf and grandmother?

[–] Sotuanduso@lemm.ee 33 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Look for a bonnet. Wolves don't wear bonnets.

[–] grue@lemmy.world 38 points 4 months ago (1 children)
[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 49 points 4 months ago

Yeah, that's a grandmother, so what?

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[–] Th4tGuyII@fedia.io 156 points 4 months ago (3 children)

The idea of AI automated job interviews sickens me. How little of a fuck do you have to give about applicants that you can't even be bothered to have even a single person interview them??

[–] Fisch@discuss.tchncs.de 87 points 4 months ago (3 children)

But god forbid the applicant didn't spend hours researching every little detail about a company, writing a perfect letter with information that could have just been bullet points and being able to explain exactly why they absolutely love the company and why it's been their dream to work there since they were a child. Or even worse: Use AI to write the application.

[–] Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 34 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Cover letters fucking make me hateful. I love generating AI cover letters and sending them. Fuck your cover letters in a market where you need to send 100 applications to get 10 bites

[–] Tangent5280@lemmy.world 30 points 4 months ago (1 children)

We should build an AI that automates researching about a company for applicants

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[–] eager_eagle@lemmy.world 16 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

That's more like an excuse to keep those stupid 5, 6, and even more interview round processes. Basically making you work an entire week for free in exchange of a chance of getting an offer. Make the first or second rounds with AI and only bother after that.

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[–] The_Picard_Maneuver@lemmy.world 95 points 4 months ago (1 children)

"Bias automation" is kind of an accurate description for how our brains learn things too.

[–] riskable@programming.dev 85 points 4 months ago (9 children)

The base assumption is that you can tell anything reliable at all about a person from their body language, speech patterns, or appearance. So many people think they have an intuition for such things but pretty much every study of such things comes to the same conclusion: You can't.

The reason why it doesn't work is because the world is full of a diverse set of cultures, genetics, and subtle medical conditions. You may be able to attain something like 60% accuracy for certain personality traits from an interview if the person being interviewed was born and raised in the same type of environment/culture (and is the same sex) as you. Anything else is pretty much a guarantee that you're going to get it wrong.

That's why you should only ask interviewees empirical questions that can identify whether or not they have the requisite knowledge to do the job. For example, if you're hiring an electrical engineer ask them how they would lay out a circuit board. Or if hiring a sales person ask them questions about how they would try to sell your specific product. Or if you're hiring a union-busting expert person ask them how they sleep at night.

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[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 87 points 4 months ago (1 children)

That shit works IRL too. Why do you think therapy practices often have themselves positioned in front of a wall of books? Not that it's a bad thing; it's good for outcomes to believe your therapist is competent and well educated.

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[–] cley_faye@lemmy.world 81 points 4 months ago (3 children)

There's a ton of great small scale things we can do with machine learning, and even LLM.

Unfortunately, it seems the main usages will be crushing people down even more.

[–] uis@lemm.ee 22 points 4 months ago (1 children)
[–] AnxiousOtter@lemmy.world 17 points 4 months ago (1 children)
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[–] TAG@lemmy.world 77 points 4 months ago (1 children)

That reminds me of the time, quite a few years ago, Amazon tried to automate resume screening. They trained a machine learning model with anonymized resumes and whether the candidate was hired. Then they looked at what the AI was looking at. The model had trained itself on how to reject women.

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[–] fubarx@lemmy.ml 70 points 4 months ago (7 children)

Someone should build a little AI app that scrapes a job listing, then takes a resume and rewrites it in subtle ways to perfectly match the job description.

Let your AI duke it out with their AI.

[–] magnolia_mayhem@lemmy.world 54 points 4 months ago (1 children)

When I got out of the military, my outprocessing included a briefing about how to get interviews with federal organizations. One thing they taught us was that you can copy the job description, paste it into your resume, and set the font to white. The automated systems at USA Jobs would register a match to the job description and rate you as a better candidate and the human screeners were so overworked that they would just go with what the computer says without checking.

[–] BobGnarley@lemm.ee 20 points 4 months ago (1 children)

I wonder if this still works lol that's brilliant.

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[–] KazuyaDarklight@lemmy.world 30 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)
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[–] cheddar@programming.dev 65 points 4 months ago (2 children)

One of my favorite examples is when a company from India (I think?) trained their model to regulate subway gates. The system was supposed to analyze footage and open more gates when there were more people, and vice versa. It worked well until one holiday when there were no people, but all gates were open. They eventually discovered that the system was looking at the clock visible on the video, rather than the number of people.

Just an expensive timer.

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[–] Xanis@lemmy.world 64 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (7 children)

I do that shit when I have a web interview. Put up a guitar just visible in the camera, a small bookshelf, a floor lamp, make sure my tennis bag is visible despite not playing in ages...

Whether they realize it or not, people do take this stuff in. Not sure why some algorithm based on these very same interviews wouldn't do the same.

[–] mrgreyeyes@feddit.nl 45 points 4 months ago (3 children)

I did the same, but they were not impressed by my Obedience extreme sex bench 5000 with restraint straps. I even told them the sturdy bench is made of durable, heavy-duty steel, capable of supporting up to 400 pounds of weight.

smh.

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[–] magnolia_mayhem@lemmy.world 60 points 4 months ago (2 children)

To be fair, this works with humans, too.

[–] Laser@feddit.org 48 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Hence the comment about "bias automation"

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[–] pufferfisherpowder@lemmy.world 25 points 4 months ago

Yes, contradicting the claim that it's "more objective".

[–] UltraGiGaGigantic@lemm.ee 59 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Recruiters: "people are using AI to apply! Shame on those lazy wage slaves!"

Also recruiters:

[–] MinusPi@pawb.social 56 points 4 months ago (3 children)

I fucking hate that extraversion is a measured trait 🙄

[–] DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 30 points 4 months ago

I hate that they think bookshelves are an indicator for it

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[–] SOB_Van_Owen@lemm.ee 52 points 4 months ago (1 children)

One web LLM I was screwing around with had Job Interview as a preset. Ok. Played it totally straight the first time and had a totally positive outcome. Thought the interviewer way too agreeable. The next time I said the most inappropriate stuff I could imagine and still the interviewer agreed to come home with me to check out the rock collection I keep under my bed and listen to Captain Beefheart albums.

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[–] RadicalEagle@lemmy.world 45 points 4 months ago (1 children)

During the AI goldrush you can make your fortune selling bookshelves.

[–] Rozz@lemmy.sdf.org 26 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Selling bookshelf large poster, or just jpgs

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[–] RoyaltyInTraining@lemmy.world 38 points 4 months ago (3 children)

Why are the different scales connected? How exactly does one interpolate between agreeableness and neuroticism? This is the kind of diagram I used to draw as an 8 year old, and they put this crap in a real product...

[–] maniclucky@lemmy.world 21 points 4 months ago (1 children)

They shouldn't be plotted that way technically. The big 5 are independent traits so they should essentially be sliders, not linked like that.

That said, it's way easier to see the points when you do that. Easy to miss when colors swap, for example, without the lines when you've been looking at this stuff for a few hours.

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[–] alcedine@discuss.tchncs.de 35 points 4 months ago (3 children)

"Machine learning" is perfectly cromulent. The bias is what it learned, because that's what it was taught. (Not intentionally, I don't think. It's just hard to get this stuff right sometimes.)

[–] Venator@lemmy.nz 42 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Job interviews are all bias regardless of whether they're automated 😅

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 18 points 4 months ago

I'm really good at my job.

But that's not why I got my job, it's just a coincidence.

I got my job because I'm pretty good at interviews.

[–] daellat@lemmy.world 19 points 4 months ago (1 children)
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[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 32 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

I'm not working right now because I'm putting my daughter through online school. (Also due to an illness) She graduates in five years.

I am never getting another job, am I?

[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 29 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Just have a bookshelf behind you during the interview, you'll be golden.

Or maybe have the oval office as a backdrop, that might really make you qualified.

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[–] Colonel_Panic_@lemm.ee 31 points 4 months ago (28 children)

I really hate that we are calling this wave of technology "AI", because it isn't. It is "Machine Learning" sure, but it is just brute force pattern recognition v2.0.

The desired outcomes you define and then the data you train it on both have a LOT of built-in biases.

It's a cool technology I guess, but it's being misused across the board. It is being overused and misused by every company with FOMO. Hoping to get some profit edge on the competition. How about we have AI replace the bullshit CEO and VP positions instead of trying to replace fast food drive through workers and Internet content.

I guess that's nothing new for humans... One human invents the spear for fishing and the rest use them to hit each other over the head.

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[–] acockworkorange@mander.xyz 30 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Answering the question in the image: machine learning arose from the industrial control world. The idea was to teach a machine how to detect defects in supposedly identical objects out of a manufacturing line, most often with “machine vision” (ie. a camera). Applying it to humans was asinine.

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[–] Djtecha@lemm.ee 28 points 4 months ago

This has job descrimination lawsuit written all over it.

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