this post was submitted on 09 Sep 2023
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No Stupid Questions

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Why the hell is every app and program out there just being prude bitches and making porn harder to access?

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[–] skullgiver@popplesburger.hilciferous.nl 151 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

In short: it's a massive pain that comes with responsibilities other content doesn't.

Hosting porn is a responsibility nightmare. You need to have a system in place to verify that all people depicted in porn are consenting adults who agree to having content hosted with you. Pornhub killed most of its catalogue to implement such a system and competitors are getting sued for not doing the same. Movie theaters have shown porn movies that have later turned out to be rape, and the porn industry is full of videos depicting actors or actresses that did not consent to beforehand. Think "casting couch" except someone who thought they were getting into modelling gets getting dragged into a room right after signing a vague contract. The studio will say it's all an act, but that's not what the victim says when the video comes out. Luckily, hosting copyrighted content is already illegal, so you can squish that problem before it becomes too big a deal.

Next, you need to differentiate between porn and revenge porn. There are organisations and companies that focus on helping revenge porn victims get their shit offline, and if you're hosting porn, you could save yourself a lawsuit or bad publicity by working together with them. That's going to cost time and money, but it's better than the alternative.

Then you need to make sure that the porn that gets uploaded isn't child porn. There are APIs to check uploads against known, existing footage, but you still need to be ready to take action if content that law enforcement didn't know about gets uploaded. One or those tasks is judging whether or not the people depicted in that type of porn are adults or not.

Of course you'll need to follow local laws. How many small Lemmy operators followed the law when some douche spammed child porn on the shitpost community? I doubt many of them read the law before purging the images! Some places demand you keep an isolated copy for law enforcement, but any sane person would want to purge such content from their servers as quickly as possible.

Any hosting service needs to be protected against CSAM, but when you set up a site people come to jerk off to, the probability of this trash getting uploaded becomes a lot higher.

Then you need to implement measures to prevent exposing minors to porn, because that's a crime in many countries. That means registering age/date of birth and hoping nobody sues you because it's easy to lie about it. Most websites use 18 as a cutoff for access to porn, but not every country considers 18 to be the age you can watch smut.

Apps need to be sabotaged because major app stores don't want you to see porn. Apple is more strict in this than Google, but you'll still need to watch out. If you accidentally break your filters or a mistagged post appears during review, you'd better have a good explanation to the reviewers about why they should let you publish your app.

Then there's the business side of things. Puritans may get pissy, but that's the least of your troubles. All major international credit card processing companies have either explicit or implicit terms that state you can't do business with them if you host porn. This is because a) these companies are your typical puritan American big business and b) people who buy porn often get found out or regret their decision, which is followed by a fraudulent charge back, and that costs you and the processing company money. If you're taking money from paying customers, you'd better read the fine print because you may just be cut off at any random moment in time.

If you make money through ads, you either use one of the few companies that accept porn (and make every ad on your site a gambling ad or a porn ad) or you figure out how to comply. Perhaps you can disable advertising around porn, or lie about your policies and hope nobody over at Google double checks.

Onlyfans makes use of weird rules about art and other technicalities that expensive people came up with. Platforms like Patreon nearly got screwed over for allowing porn. It's possible to make money with platforms allowing porn, but it's certainly not cheap or easy.

Lastly, there's porn laws. Japan, land of the tentacles and schoolgirls, has strict laws forcing genitalia to be censored. In the UK, spanking and face sitting is considered illegal. In some countries porn is banned in its entirety, in others there are laws government drawn porn (hentai/rule34) and more specifically if drawings of children constitute child porn. In some American states you need to do special identification to make sure your visitors are adults. If you sell access, there are special tax rates for porn that differ per state/country.

The solution to all of these problems for most sites is to either ban porn so they don't need to take special care, or to have special cases for porn with dedicated rules. Usually the most liberal of American states is used as a reference point and from thst point onwards you cross your fingers and hope nobody sues you, and that your holidays abroad aren't cut short by a border agent checking your history.

[–] FangedWyvern42@lemmy.world 30 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Good to know, that law was asbsolutely ridiculous.

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[–] JTskulk@lemmy.world 106 points 1 year ago

Bro if you're having a hard time finding porn on the Internet, the problem is you!

[–] all-knight-party@kbin.cafe 93 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Advertisers don't like it, and won't advertise where there's porn. Advertisers pay for most of these websites' existence. They capitulate to the demands.

[–] Starb3an@sh.itjust.works 25 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Every porn site I've ever been too is loaded with ads so they can't be too bad. I will admit almost every ad is for other porn sites/scams

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[–] sciawp@lemm.ee 10 points 1 year ago

Don’t forget about payment processors like visa that can enforce restrictions on NSFW content

[–] dingleberry@discuss.tchncs.de 39 points 1 year ago (1 children)

What kind of gourmet shit are you hunting for?

[–] thorbot@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Gourmet shit, obviously.

Scat Apps hate this one simple trick!

[–] iforgotmyinstance@lemmy.world 38 points 1 year ago

You are doing internet wrongly.

[–] sin_free_for_00_days@sopuli.xyz 33 points 1 year ago (2 children)

-> pornhub.com

-> xvideos.com

[–] gullible@kbin.social 73 points 1 year ago (5 children)

An adjacent question that you brought to mind, why are people so intent on using “apps” for everything. It feels as if browsers have been all but forgotten despite filling the same role, but often better.

[–] DigitalAudio@sopuli.xyz 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)

On the one hand you're right, but on the other I feel like a lot of stuff has become browser based (like text editors, code editors, even music editors and perhaps video editors someday), all thanks to Web Assembly and how complex a lot of web apps have become.

It feels like people use everyday stuff through apps, and more complex stuff through browsers nowadays. Roles may slowly invert at some point if it keeps going this way.

[–] cfi@lemmy.world 35 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Everything that should be an app has become a web page and everything that should be a web page has become an app

[–] Jimmycrackcrack@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 year ago

Oh my god this is perfect. That's exactly the state of things.

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[–] SgtAStrawberry@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Because a lot of websites still look and function really bad on mobile devices, and a lot of people nowadays only have mobile devices.

[–] abbadon420@lemm.ee 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Pornhub works fine on a mobile browser, or so they say

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[–] ryathal@sh.itjust.works 31 points 1 year ago

Advertising is the big one. Many companies simply don't want to advertise anywhere where porn is present even if it's segregated.

Payment processors is the next big one. Most processors won't service porn sites which makes it hard to collect money for sites with porn. You get stuck with worse service and higher rates.

Legal compliance is another big problem. Lots of countries have lots of different laws and operating a porn website can get you in trouble in places you weren't aware of if you aren't careful. You need to verify ages, and consent of both users and models. In some countries simply looking younger than 18/whatever age can be a problem.

Overall if a site has mixed content, it can be much less hassle and much more income to drop the porn if there's sufficient non-porn content.

[–] jhulten@infosec.pub 30 points 1 year ago

I think a lot of folks are forgetting that Visa and MC are prudes and gatekeep money.

[–] foggy@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Competition is so cutthroat. If you started a new porn service today there would CSAM on your servers tomorrow.

Would it be actionable? Diubtful. Not to say it isn't happening out there but these incidents are largely competition playing dirty.

I base this on nothing. Welcome to the internet.

[–] Astroturfed@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I claim you are completely wrong. You clearly have no idea what you are talking. Based on my feelings, so I'm right.

[–] foggy@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I am actually the world leading exper in being wrong and nuh uh

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[–] cabron_offsets@lemmy.world 25 points 1 year ago (6 children)

… and here I am, actively blocking porn or porn-adjacent shit on Lemmy.

[–] Chriszz@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Am I the only one who has seen absolutely no porn on lemmy ever? I haven’t had to block any but I would if I saw it. Where are you guys seeing this?

[–] frosty99c@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

When you signed up, did you select "Show NSFW content?"

[–] Chriszz@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That might be it. I can’t remember but it would explain why I don’t see any porn.

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[–] eee@lemm.ee 8 points 1 year ago (3 children)

that's your choice, and that's entirely fine. but it's different when a platform deliberately makes it inaccessible.

[–] RightHandOfIkaros@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)
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I like porn. I'm a fan. But I'm with you on that. If I want it, I know where to get it. It's not really why I'm here.

Also, it really ruins it for me that because it's all user -contributed, it feels like being recommended porn by a creepy, off-puttingly thirsty highschooler. Given the demographics in places like this, that may actually be somewhat close to reality

[–] Zippy@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I can understand why a person has no interest in it and I personally don't need to access it but I also don't really care if it available. I do not become offended if it is available.

In reality I am far more uncomfortable with violent content yet they seem to get far less attention then porn.

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[–] who8mydamnoreos@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Same, Its not that i don’t like porn but i got tired of blocking every instance of furry porn; like how many do you need?

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[–] FleetingTit@feddit.de 19 points 1 year ago (4 children)

It isn't advertising friendly, that's why. Also online children protection act or some such law.

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[–] Granixo@feddit.cl 18 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Please put the NSFW tag on the post.

Then we can talk about the good stuff.

[–] qisope@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

no, then it would be too easy for op to access

[–] rbesfe@lemmy.ca 17 points 1 year ago

Porn is easier to access than it's ever been, unless you live in a country with heavy internet censorship

[–] cooopsspace@infosec.pub 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I've got a few theories:

My guess is that certain companies are concerned about repercussions related to porn related content due to an impending buyout or IPO. Personally I don't blame them.

Advertisers hate it, payment providers hate it.

Fediverse has recently been attacked by CP spammers, and instances like the one I'm on has actually shut off image sharing all together.

Moderation is a problem globally, even if this content slips through automated filtering there will always be exposure, and always people affected. And unfortunately the tolerance for CP or even copyrighted content is precisely zero due to public backlash and the news articles.

[–] space@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Exactly. There are a lot of sketchy porn related businesses, and porn is ripe with abuse. Also, porn sites have a moderation problem. It is difficult to verify that the videos people upload don't contain CP (it's hard to tell someone's age just by looking at them), rape, if the people actually consented to the video being uploaded etc. PH decided to just delete all non-verified uploaders, and it is understandable why.

A lot of businesses just don't want to be associated with that, or have to moderate that, or have any involvement. And this also affects their relationship with other businesses.

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[–] sebinspace@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Actually a skill issue.

Seriously, don’t even leave this site, just go to the search bar and look up whatever you’re into, there’s probably a comm specifically for it. Even you sounding freaks.

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[–] fernandorincon@reddthat.com 12 points 1 year ago (4 children)

My lemmy feed has so much porn that I had to turn on the filter

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[–] Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)
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[–] fiat_lux@kbin.social 10 points 1 year ago

Because people don't want to look at other people's unusual niche kinks and try to identify if it contains children or other non-consenting participants as a part of their employment. And then try to explain to the people about why the unusual niche is against the rules when they receive a complaint about its removal. Amongst so many other reasons.

Programs and apps on the internet are not simple things and user-generated content can be a very malicious and dangerous thing to have a copy of. The legal risk alone is not worth it, let alone the effort required to enable a slightly easier masturbatory experience for total strangers.

[–] TruTollTroll@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I see so much porn on this site lemmy alone... scroll by new and hot, and you find tons of it... it's actually kind of annoying how often I see naked chicks and dicks and more on this site compared to others that do good at censoring it from the front pages...

[–] dragonflyteaparty@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Huh, I never see porn, but then I sort by the 12 hour thing.

[–] TruTollTroll@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

Yeah, if I sort by new, or hot, I will get plenty of boob/vag images.. not that I'm hating, I believe women should be able to post this is they want, but I also am not a huge porn consumer as woman myself.. it's just not my bag. Lol so it can be a little surpriseing to see full bodies after reading musk foiled Ukrainian plans, the Wisconsin GOP trying to impeach an elected (D) supreme court judge, and then bam! Crotch shot lmao 🤣😂

[–] SkyNTP@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Depends on your home instance I guess. Lemmy.ml has an outright ban, so some only slips through once in a blue moon.

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