this post was submitted on 21 Jul 2023
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Privacy

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And since you won't be able to modify web pages, it will also mean the end of customization, either for looks (ie. DarkReader, Stylus), conveniance (ie. Tampermonkey) or accessibility.

The community feedback is... interesting to say the least.

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[–] narc0tic_bird@lemm.ee 441 points 1 year ago (20 children)

What the fuck is happening to the internet recently?

Twitter and Reddit CEOs completely losing their minds, and now Google of all companies wants to lock down the whole internet?

This isn't even close to being okay. It's 100% bullshit.

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 220 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Interest rates going up means investors are demanding more profit so all the tricks web companies have held off on till now are coming out.

[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 172 points 1 year ago (2 children)

A lot of them never had to make a profit before.

Rich idiots threw money at anything because while a million dollars is more than the vast amount of us will ever have, to them it's like buying a lotto scratcher.

The underlying issue is wealth imbalance.

[–] PoliticalAgitator@lemm.ee 78 points 1 year ago

That wealth imbalance also pushes companies to force dumb shit like this on thier customers.

If Google were to just come out with a $10 a month plan that removed all the sleazy ways they try and profit from you, the overwhemling response would be "Oh great yet another subscription", because these subscriptions have become a significant chunk of people's income each month.

But what if greedy neoliberals hadn't been pocketing our pay rises for $20 years and that subscription was functionally $1? Most people would be happy to blow $20 supporting 20 different content providers.

Unfortunately, their greed is insatiable. There's always a room of executives doing their grubby little sums. "If people have $1, they probably have $2. We could double our profits! Then double our salaries!".

Inflation just means "If rich people find out you've got more money, they'll fuck you out of that too".

The $1 will never be enough. They'll keep charging more and more until people have nothing left to hand over. Then they'll figure out more ways to squeeze a profit out of you. Manipulating you with ads, selling your private data, turning your body into expensive dogfood -- whatever makes them a few more cents.

[–] Kichae@kbin.social 27 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

And one of the primary reasons they never had to make a profit was that, so long as interest rates were functionally zero, it didn't really cost the investor class much of anything to park money in a money losing operation while waiting for it to become sellable.

With interest rates back to pre-2008 levels, though, there's a price to money again. And a real opportunity cost. So, compete with bonds or watch your investors walk.

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 43 points 1 year ago

It's like in Silicon Valley when the VC tells them they don't need to be profitable they just need to market, then as soon as he dips below technically being a billionaire he demands that they focus on being profitable immediately

[–] Hazzia@discuss.tchncs.de 38 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Better time than ever to be a FOSS enjoyer, that's for sure

[–] hellishharlot@lemmy.world 39 points 1 year ago

Honestly, this second half of 2023 for me has been about finding FOSS options for literally everything. And eventually I'll have a home server I can use for the things I can't use on the cloud

[–] ddnomad@infosec.pub 107 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

The enshittification of the internet shall continue.

We will fight and we will lose, as depressing as it sounds. The vast majority of people just don’t and won’t care.

[–] i_love_FFT@lemmy.ml 72 points 1 year ago (1 children)

We're on Lemmy. We're already winning!

[–] demystify@lemmy.ml 41 points 1 year ago (1 children)

We may win a battle or few, but not the war.

[–] tryptaminev@feddit.de 25 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Then i'll scrape the songs i currently watch on youtube with jdownload and stop using the page otherwise.

All they do is make the internet less attractive. Now that works to increase profits for a while, but eventually the content creators withdraw, the platforms become worse and eventually uncool and people stop using it, or use it less. Facebook is on a decline in western countries. We went through multiple video snippet apps already and tiktok and instagram too will be declining eventually.

We dont have to win the war because the war will never end. We just gotta make the best out of the battlefields we win.

[–] dontblink@feddit.it 22 points 1 year ago

But a small minority of really determined people is enough to change the world 🙌

I love to see how people nowadays find easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.. That's how they've been brainwashing us till now.

[–] borlax@lemmy.borlax.com 12 points 1 year ago

You'll finish your enshittification and you'll like it!

[–] fearout@kbin.social 60 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I know, right? It’s so weird. In every single instance of some bullshit happening it’s easy to brush it off as incompetence or an attempt at profit maximization, but overall it feels a lot like some kind of targeted disassembly of whatever made the internet great and facilitated open discussions.

[–] Cube6392@beehaw.org 67 points 1 year ago (10 children)

I don't think it's coordinated, I think it all starts from the same root cause: Silicon Valley Bank failed. These companies all need to do something they've really not done much of in the past: turn a profit. But these companies are not run by the business geniuses we were once convinced were running the show. Most of them live so far removed from a normal persons life that they don't understand what motivates us, what we want in a platform, and as soon as we provide feedback after they've already made a decision, they decide it's because we don't understand the squeeze they're under to make money.

  • Twitter: Elon Musk thinks he could make more money from subscriptions than advertisements. The whole thing's a disaster because that's really dumb. This case may be a little different though because there's some evidence Musk just wanted more people to see his tweets and to pay people to be his friend
  • Reddit: Spez fails to see that he has multiple revenue sources available to him so long as he keeps his users around. Somewhere, there was the right balance of charging for the API at a reasonable price, performing better market research on his user base to provide a better ad platform, and keeping the Reddit coin system in place as the base liked it because the user base paid more for that than most similar online payment schemes.
  • Google: this is the scary one. This is the one that seems like they know exactly what they're doing. They're ramping up their enshittification following the fall of SVB, but the way they're doing it is both malicious and a minor enough inconvenience that the majority of their users will stay. And they're doing it in small quiet ways. A little bit of tweaking how YouTube bans users here. A little bit of RFCs about DRM on the web there. Some PRs to chromium and android no one will notice. All to squeeze more ads into peoples online experiences. Their search product has been utter shit for about 6 years now, but people still prefer it over Bing or DuckDuckGo (which is a wrapper for Bing). They've learned the following lesson: if you're big enough, the citizens of the web will let you do it
[–] TheHighRoad@lemmy.world 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I 100% would have signed up for Reddit Premium and payed monthly for Sync access if they had allowed me to hand them the money. Oh well ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

[–] fearout@kbin.social 12 points 1 year ago

Right? I had a subscription for Apollo and am now supporting kbin on Patreon (btw, guys, here’s the link if someone wants to help out).

It wasn’t that hard to offer a product that people would be fine paying for.

[–] fearout@kbin.social 18 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That's a good write up, thanks. I don't claim it's coordinated, just that it feels more and more that way.

Also, I switched to DDG a year or so ago and I haven't heard that it was a wrapper for Bing. So I went to google it (I can't not use this verb when talking about online searches, lol), and it seems like it's not really the case. It gets some results from bing and utilises their ads to make profit, but it seems like it's a small part of their output. Is that incorrect? Do you have some more info about it being a wrapper? I'm kinda curious now

[–] Cube6392@beehaw.org 3 points 1 year ago

I'd be happy to hear that's true. They were originally an aggregator until Google changed their api

[–] 4am@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Elon Musk wanted to drive Twitter into the dirt once he was forced to buy it. Criticism, jet tracking, rejection of fascist-adjacent opinions that are “logical” but only if you’re a heartless engineering robot.

His hubris forced him into buying it, but once he had to, he might as well destroy it. How else do you think he got the Saudis in on it for another billion?

I laughed about this theory at first, just memeing it like “ha could you even imagine?” But every single day it seems more and more like he does the worst thing possible to “monetize” and then gripes about it like the only reason his brilliance isn’t working is because big mean liberal woke mind virus society is trying to do cancel culture because they’re just jealous he’s rich.

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[–] mounderfod@lemmy.sdf.org 26 points 1 year ago

It can be a combo of several objectives:

  • make a shitload of money
  • stop people from realising we're making a shitload of money off of their backs
  • keep people poor so that even if they do realise there's nothing they can do about it
[–] frevaljee@kbin.social 48 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Google has already been a worthless pos for years. Impossible to get relevant results, even with operators. You just get ads and irrelevant SEO sites. And adding "reddit" at the end of the query will probably not work so well in the future either, seeing how that site has also gone to shit.

And they have already tried monopolising the entire internet with their amp bullshit.

So this is just in line with their vision of making the whole internet into a pile of burning shit under their total control.

[–] stewie3128@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Hello from Kagi. It's better over here.

[–] frevaljee@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah I've been a little interested in trying Kagi, but it is quite expensive... Are the results that much better?

[–] stewie3128@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago

They give you a couple searches for free each month (I think it's 10) - go try it out!

[–] Zetaphor@zemmy.cc 35 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Nothing about this is recent, those who pay attention to the standards process have been screaming for ages about the Google problem. It's just that now between interest rates being what they are and them having a monopoly on the browser market that they're cashing in on their investment.

[–] banazir@lemmy.ml 32 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Recently? This is a long time coming. Users have been accepting all kinds of shit from big players without complaint. Even if they protest it's usually just performative and they keep using the services, sites and software that violates all kinds notions of user and privacy rights. Most people unfortunately are (understandably) not equipped to really even understand the kind of shady shit these companies pull on the daily. The internet is going to shit and its users will gobble it up and ask for more. It has been frustrating watching this happen, but there's really very little that can be done.

[–] miss_brainfart@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The main problem with us users is that we are god damn lazy. We want everything to be the most convenient it possibly can be.

Remember when Apple updated iOS to allow users to stop cross-app tracking, which severly upset the Zuck, that absolute manchild?

Turns out that if you actually inform people and give them a clear choice to make, the overwhelming majority of users do in fact not agree with being tracked, as an example.

[–] sijt@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

and now Google of all companies wants to lock down the whole internet?

Of all the companies, Google always seemed the most likely, both to want to and to be successful. They’ve tried before, sometimes in small ways, sometimes in larger more obvious ways (AMP, the implementation of content filtering in Chrome etc.).

They’re the world’s largest advertising and data harvesting company. It’s their business. Of course they want to lock the internet down to serve their goals of learning as much about you as possible and using that data to shove ads in your face.

Whenever using any Google/Alphabet product you have to ask yourself, “am I ok with this thing I’m about to use being built by the world’s largest advertising company?”. The answer should be “no” more than it is “yes”, particularly for things that have access to lots of your data, like web browsers, phones, home speakers etc.

[–] UnculturedSwine@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago

The tech sector just hit a major correction recently. Wall Street found companies like Google to be overvalued and as such their stocks suffered. This is Google trying to claw back some of that value. See step 3 in the enshittification process. This isn't just Google. It's the entire tech sector.

[–] dontblink@feddit.it 19 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Luckly we still have free platforms like lemmy, browsers like Firefox, networks like tor or i2p, torrents, monetary system like bitcoin.

We can step out of the world of and we are the ones who have the most intruments to do so.

[–] Izzy@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

Yes, which works for the few, but they know that the majority are completely oblivious and will just consume whatever they are given.

[–] phario@lemmy.ca 17 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I haven’t read the replies but there was a very interesting episode by Derek Thomson’s Plain English podcast which I found incredibly interesting.

Derek made the conjecture that we were on a cusp of a big paradigm shift in the Internet.

For the last 20 years, it was essentially about building a consumer basis. So companies like Netflix and Facebook and Amazon did not care about current profits. The point was to just get consumers, drive out the competition, and commandeer the monopoly.

Now and especially post Covid companies like Twitter are realising that this isn’t going to work. The next movement is going to all be about paying models. This is what we’re seeing with Twitter. This is what we’re seeing with OnlyFans or Patreon.

So in light of the above comments, none of this is surprising. The next era will be about paid models of the internet.

I need to find that episode as it was extremely prophetic. It might have potentially been this one https://open.spotify.com/episode/2zRha9y46btKdAfwfHpvQ5?si=_jkP3iX7TXOesHLsoY9Vxw

[–] Valmond@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

Sounds you might enjoy the Enshittification of TikTok article floating around. It explains quite well the mechanism why a site have to becoming worse and worse over time.

[–] Fangslash@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Because for the first time in 14 years money is no longer free.

Right now the interest rate sits at 5% and it will remain there for the foreseeable future. Investors no longer have the patients to wait for growth because bonds are actually investable now, so all your “get user first find business later” companies began to panic and tries to squeeze everything out of its users.

Hilariously, the only social media company that will come out of this relatively unharmed is probably Facebook, because their unethical practices actually makes money

This is what so many people said is coming.

[–] lemmyvore@feddit.nl 13 points 1 year ago

What do you mean, Google of all companies... It's a company that makes 90% of its money from ads and all of its products are made with the express purpose of enabling them to spy on you or creating technical dependencies so you can't quit their services.

Plus they've already tried to lock the web into proprietary formats (AMP, PWA etc.) and have maneuvered so they have 90% of the browser market and the smartphone market but can't be actioned for it.

[–] Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Growth reaches a saturation point and now they have to cannibalise every single thing in order to continue growth (in company values). This comes at the expense of product quality for the person using it but that's fine if you have no competition because everything is a monopoly.

The capitalist system is the problem. The system will ALWAYS reach this endpoint for as long as it is a system that demands infinite growth.

[–] Valmond@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

Check out "enshittification"

[–] HeavenAndHell@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

IDK, but we need to riot. Fuck google.

[–] privacyn@feddit.it 8 points 1 year ago

This happens when something, in this case the Internet, is a monopoly or oligopoly.

[–] Psaldorn@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

Their fake advert viewing numbers and YouTube's inability to monetise without ruining itself are forcing them to think of new ways to encrapsulate user's and drain their wallets.

Instead of, you know, providing a service people want and would pay for.

[–] sLLiK@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 year ago

AI happened. The promises, benefits, opportunity for massive financial gain, and the clear and present danger of how transformative it can be have all caused internet-bases companies to throw out the rulebook and lose their collective minds.

[–] AnonymousLlama@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago

A race to the bottom with who can come up with the next dogshit idea on how to ruin the internet and make things actively worse for the people who use it