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Good for you! That time with your family is really important.
I'm from the US and I caused quite a stir when I took 4 weeks off; 3 days paternity leave and the rest was accrued vacation. HR was trying to convince me to break it up because "it would self a bad precedent." But my boss was supportive and approved it anyway.
What moron would pass up on 85% paid leave??
My US company went ham on paternity leave. I adopted a 3-day-old and got 12 weeks leave.
I provided pretty decent support from home for my position for the first week, I did small things and help people in my department get up to speed on what I had to do. I was kind of sleep deprived but they needed the help to start with. 9 times out of 10 I was holding the baby because at that age there's not much you're doing other than holding feeding or changing them. And that's what they really need.
I then took a solid 6 weeks of only minimal interactions. I would drop in on occasional daily meetings mostly so I knew what was going on.
The vast majority of my work can happen from home. The sleep deprivation and bonding time are the important things to take care of, along with giving my partner a decent level of support and adjustment time. Putting in a little work here and there in between things actually gave me a little bit of mental stimulus when I needed it.
The six to eight week period, I ramped up a little more and remotely attended most meetings. I started coming in a few times a week from 8 to 12 weeks so that my partner didn't feel my support just fall off a cliff for 8 hours a day.
It's important to get that early bonding time in, it's important to give your partner the support they need to adjust. I honestly feel that what I did makes a lot more sense than just 12 weeks of off time. I think I'd probably rather have 8 weeks solid and then have another 4 weeks of flexible PTO that I could take around them learning to crawl, walk, have medical issues.
Nothing about child rearing fits nicely into a 12-week box.
Absolutely take paternity. Why wouldn't you?
I scheduled two weeks off for the birth of my first child. Not paternity leave, just vacation time. My wife became a SAHM a few months before. I was bored and went back to work after 1 week. I couldn't imagine 12 weeks.
The kid is just not doing that much. Feed, poop, change, sleep. And the child doesn't recognize you at that stage. It's all stimulus response. If he was crying and I picked him up, he didn't care. I got zero emotional reward for the interaction with the child. Emotional bonding all happened around 3 months old and beyond. Before that the benefit was more in the shared experience with my wife of learning how to take care of a newborn. But really, it's not that hard, and after one week it was old hat.
12 weeks paternity leave at 85% salary? Damn, that's sweet, even by many EU standards.
I wouldn't think twice about taking it.
Don't listen to those morons. Paternity leave is a legit great way to stay with your wife and children when they need it the most.
Yea F those tools that judge you on wanting to be there for your wife and kid.
For some providing a reliable income is their way of supporting, but man is it great to actually provide the time to be there in person
Your coworkers desperately need class consciousness, working until your bones give out is not "supporting your family" its being a wage slave.
My Colorado Comrades in corporate environments take the time. I've seen a number of guys go out on Paternity since we enacted paid paternity leave in our state. It's legally protected, we fought and voted for it. If your boss doesn't like it they can eat shit and die because it's your right. Your family is more important than some corporate nonsense.
Most democratic countries have a full 12 months leave or more for whichever parent ( or shared between both.) Maybe this lack of early bonding and co-regulation between family members explains US as it is today.
Nah, it's the lead and microplastics
Both parents should be entitled to take 12 months leave as a minimum, and their employer should be required to pay their salary and protect their position during that time.
I believe in leave for having a child but how do you picture this working unless it is government funded? Lad and lass get out of college at 22. Enter their first job. Are there for 6 months to a year, and then take a year off, go back to work for 6-12 months, off for a year. Now they are 25-26 years old, 2 kids and have at most 2 years of experience in their field. Have only worked for the company for most 2 years and had 2 years off. In which then many would leave that job as it no longer fits around their schedules assuming the business didn't do layoffs and such.
I know a lot of people think they'll wait till their older to have kids but a lot of that is about time and financial security. If I knew my job was secure when I was coming out of college I would have married my then fiancee and would have reproduced 2-3 times at that age. Putting 60,000 young humans in a small area made for a lot of active fit horny people. I know a lot of Universities are smaller, but either way, I can't see any small businesses surviving it. They'd all have to choose to hire 35+ year old workers to lower their odds of paying out the leave. (Unless like mentioned previously it's all covered by the state)
I mean, I'm no economist so I cant exactly speak on the how, but the government should be involved in the funding for this, passing the financial burden onto parents would just cause either those couples to not have kids, or not give those new born kids the adequate attention they need leading to further problems in their life.
Oh I agree it would help with birth rates. And mental health of the population. But healthy isn't what we do around here. I watched a woman with 1 arm being told off last night at work that she wasn't likely to be able to keep her performance numbers up and should consider quitting instead of trying to ask her if she would find a better fit somewhere else that would work better for her situation. They are hiring like crazy so just about every position is open. The people watch you go through a metal detector on the way in and tell you to take your keys out and try again. You can do that all day with 1 arm. (Strange that we have that, but huge company and many expensive parts I assume they are worried people might be walking out with. Or maybe it's for cameras coming in... Idk. Either way, they are hiring for positions that don't require you to belittle someone but rather find a better use, it's not like they could have gotten through interviews and paperwork without disclosing they had a disability. (Not to mention companies get tax write offs for having employees with disabilities last I checked)
-sorry for the rant, new contract one week down and learning what kind of company it is
In a lot of developed countries the employer can claim back money from the government when a employee takes maternity leave or sick leave.
That way companies don't really have a reason to discriminate based on if you might get pregnant etc.
I got it. I think it was 3 weeks. Unfortunately it was unpaid. I had to take on extra work before and after to make up for the loss in income. It was all we were allowed.
I would do it again. Those 3 weeks at home are irreplaceable. Should it be paid? Should it be longer? Abso-fucking-lutely. But paternity leave? Take it if you can get it.
I heard that early childhood (first weeks, months, maybe years) are vital for development of emotional intelligence. Neglect could lead to life-long struggles. So I'm happy to hear you favor the idea to stay and care. Good for you, you both, and all of us.
I worked during my mom's last months of life while taking care of her because the company allowed me to fully work from home, no question asked if I was available ok, if I wasn't ok too. And I brag about that. Otherwise I would have taken a sick leave to take care of my mom (which my country allows), but working gave me a good, I don't know how to say, sometimes when I had work and my mom didn't need me I didn't think about the situation and that was nice.
People should make use of their rights, although in my case I found a compromise that, in my opinion, benefited me; but this company gained my loyalty for the time being.
I was interviewing with my current company while my wife was pregnant and I didn't disclose it to them bc I didn't want it to impact my hireability. My wife was due about a month into my tenure after I got hired. I told my boss after I was hired, and only took maybe a week off. The only reason I took such a short amount of time was I didn't want my boss to think poorly of me so soon into the job and make a good 1st impression. I was sleep deprived the whole time and my performance was definitely impacted.
When my 2nd was born, you best believe I took the full 12 weeks, and every day was worth it. That bonding time is absolutely irreplaceable, and I wish I had it the first go 'round. You only get 1 chance at it. Fuck your coworkers, they're probably shitty parents.
Honestly, fuck those coworkers. What I will tell you is this: They're only newborns for so long, and after that they're only babies for so long. Those are some of the most precious moments in life. Giving that up to wage slave for a company that at the end of the day doesn't give a shit about you? When given the opportunity to experience something that will probably only happen once or twice in your lifetime? You should 100 percent go for it. The other option is looking back on how you missed out on something you will never get back. I missed out on one kids baby phase pulling 60 hour weeks. Was lucky enough to be around for my second and was able to take paternity leave. Best decision I was given, and hate myself for missing out on my first kid.
You are surrounded with workaholic, misogynists. My company gives full pay for 12 weeks for mothers and fathers. Several of my coworkers, mostly men, have used their leave in full (usually 9 weeks together and the other 3 broken up). Nobody ever looks down on people for taking leave.
Maybe they would take all of it if it was for full pay. Ya'll motherfuckers need a union.
The "work yourself to death" is a stupid boomer concept. It's a hugely negative aspect of traditional masculinity.
When people say weird stuff like this, I always question why. Why would you have a kid and then work so hard to be away from it? Why would you work for a company that will lay you off the moment it earns them a higher stock price to do so? (no modern company deserves your loyalty.) Why would you brag about suffering instead of relaxing?
I understand that we're all wired differently but those values literally don't make sense to me.
It's a "Greatest Generation" concept. Those depression-era folks unionized to be able to live a better life, then never bothered to actually retire and live that life. They worked themselves into the grave.
Boomers don't work themselves into the grave. Boomers "Retire in place".
The "work yourself to death" is a stupid boomer concept. It's a hugely negative aspect of traditional masculinity.
At least for boomers, loyalty was often rewarded with promotions, bonuses, and generous pensions. But these days companies will work you to death and then fire you for a 0.0001% boost to their quarterly profits. They'll fire 10,000 people just so the billionaire shareholders can earn 1% more.
Yup. Loyalty is a two way street. I know pretty successful companies whose former employees still speak highly of, precisely because the company did the whole "you work hard and we treat you well" thing. The moment that that trust is lost, your employees will treat you in kind. Except for some idiots falling for the propaganda of course.
You are absolutely right! 85% is nice money and especially in the first months it's super important to spend time with your new born and to support the mother.
And for all those fuckers who think that you "aren't working" in this time... Well, get a child and take care of it. It's way harder than you think. You will see, it's gonna be a hard but also rewarding time. My second daughter is now 3 months... And boy, to see everything that is happening within 3 months. It's unbelievable and makes me so happy.
You're on the right path.
Yeah probably as always only a matter of perspective. Don't listen to other men, just do what feels right for yourself.
I took a solid 9 months paternity leave with my son, and I think we just built the best base for a father son relationship I could ever imagine or hope to have. I know they don't seem like it as a baby, but you are building your foundation already.
This was 3 years ago and I still feel the outcome of it every day.
Go for it , be yourself, don't listen to others.
almost bragging how little time they took after their kids were born
I had a coworker bragging about lying to his wife that he couldn't take time off. This is fucked up on so many levels: why even have a kid? Why do you lie to your wife? Why are you telling people you barey know (I had been there for like two weeks) that you lie to your wife? WTF?
I feel like I’m missing something.
Maybe they're insecure? They don't know what to do with the new kid, and instead of figuring it out together with their partner they run back to the things they know and hide behind a fake martyrdom. I wonder how many of them will in a few months or years say that women are "naturals" when it comes to taking care of kids.
Congrats on the kid and on being an actual dad!
Why marry her if you don't like her that much? Like, seriously? I know there is the meme of "burnt-out husband spending weekends working overtime so he can avoid his wife", but those are usually failing relationships.
I went through the same thing when I took my paternity leave. Other male coworkers bragged about how they went back to work the day after their kid was born.
It's a culture thing where our society is conditioned to be boot lickers for the ruling class. I responded to them at the time, "Congratulations on being a bad father, I'm going to take every day entitled to me"
Don't fall into their trap.
Yup. Had old union buddies I was talking to after my first, and I brought up that he had a diaper blowout earlier, and they were like "I've never changed a diaper in my life!"
Just told them " damn, I'd be too embarrassed to admit I were that bad of a father in public..."
I find it hilarious when people brag about things they think are cool but it just makes them look like dumbasses.
"Lol I can drink 24 beers in one sitting"
"I never call in sick, I can be hacking up a lung and I'm still there at the office"
On and on...
Today I witnessed a group of coworkers almost bragging how little time they took after their kids were born. I've heard stuff like "Most men are hard working and want to support their families so they don't take leave".
Toxic masculinity.
This is textbook toxic masculinity.
A lot of people misuse the term, but this is an excellent example. The men involved lose out on something amazing due to it being 'unmanly'.
Paternity leave saved my life when I was a young father with an ill wife. Take as much time as you can.
Also, side note, the year I took off of work to care for them when my sons were small (3 and 5) I look back on as one of the best decisions I ever made. Despite the fact we were flirting with homelessness, the bonding and memories made a huge impact on them, and now that they're adults, we have an amazing relationship that far surpasses the distant bond I have with my own father.
this is part of your compensation. you pay state taxes for it. And you deserve it. decades of corporate propaganda has made most people believe they don't deserve leave at all. ignore the haters and take your leave.
You deserve this as much as you deserve the road you are driving on, or the tax return you get. You wouldn't skip the tax return, right? So treat it like a nice little informal tax return.
Spending the first 2 month of my child's life with them was one of the best things in my life.
Those people are jealous fucking idiots. 12 weeks is hardly anything. You get a fucking year for each parent in Norway
I’m a dad of two, and in my country (Norway) it’s mostly common to divide the leave. With my first, I had 9 months of paternity leave, 6 months with my youngest. The two best periods of my life!
