this post was submitted on 03 Nov 2024
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[–] bstix@feddit.dk 29 points 22 hours ago

Before the introduction of daylight savings, people and companies were perfectly capable of adjusting the productive hours according to the sun - if they needed to.

Farmers who are usually (wrongly) used as an example were against the clock changes, because it really isn't relevant to them and only creates problems for their schedules with live stock.

The actual reason for the daylight saving was saving energy and coal. This is not an issue anymore, because the energy used for lighting is negligible today.

The only sane thing to do is to stop changing the clocks and then focus on making working schedules more flexible.

[–] ohellidk@sh.itjust.works 111 points 1 day ago (8 children)

one day we will just stick with daylight time. its kind of a slap in the face to lose your only hour of sunlight after work!

[–] rc__buggy@sh.itjust.works 10 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (10 children)

I say this every year: FUUUUUUUUCK THAT.

With permanent DST the latest sunrise in Detroit would be 0900. That's fucking absurd. All across the US kids would be waiting for the school bus in the dark, walking to those bus stops in the dark. My personal beef with it is that I, and many of the people that make the world go 'round, start at 0600. We need to see ASAP for safety, if nothing else.

The US tried it in the early '70s, didn't even finish the two year trial period:
https://www.npr.org/2022/03/19/1087280464/the-u-s-tried-permanent-daylight-saving-time-in-the-1970s-then-quickly-rejected-

Fuck DST. If people really want it to stay light until 2100 in the summer then so be it but don't make a lot of the working class labor half their day in the dark in the depths of winter.

[–] BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 19 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (6 children)

Kids all across the US are waiting at the bus in the dark anyway.

Not everyone gets to get on a bus after sunrise.

The better answer is to just quit switching altogether, and socially adjust everything to x hours pre mid-day sun.

With everything being connected these days it's trivial (hell, industrial clocks have been tied to electrical frequency since 1900, so it's always been trivial to compensate them).

If "6am" slowly moved every day due to when mid-day sun/sunrise occurs, no one would even notice.

[–] rc__buggy@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 day ago

In the north? Here in the middle of the country it's reasonable.

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[–] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 9 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

With permanent DST the latest sunrise in Detroit would be 0900.

The entire nation doesn't need to be following year round the schedule that Detroit school kids need from November to January.

The better solution for this little problem is to go ahead and shift the entire country to permanent DST, and move Detroit from the Eastern time zone to the Central time zone. Latest sunrise in Detroit is now 8AM. Your complaint is resolved, without either of us being forced to switch our clocks twice a year.

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[–] blanketswithsmallpox@lemmy.world 52 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Now if only all people, managers, businesses, unions, realized they could set what time they worked to whatever the hell they wanted within reason, moved to somewhere closer to the equator, got up earlier to use the morning instead of the night, did stuff at night...

Either way, we need to do away with the switching lol.

[–] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 14 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Eh......I think we need to do away with the concept of money, and work, and managers owning the majority of our time.

You think a cat gives a fuck what time Starbucks closes??? Hell no! They just sleep on your bed, or on the floor, or on a table, or on the stairs, or anywhere they want, anytime they want. And they make SURE you are always looking at their butthole.

You think you can just go into starbucks, and present your butthole, to all who look at you, while also sleeping on their counter? I mean, you're TOTALLY in the way, and making everyones lives more inconvienent......but fuck 'em, ya know?

You can't do ANY of that! Because for some reason, we've all decided that little green paper controls our lives.

Or in the case of Canada, multicolored monopoly money.

[–] felbane@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

You think you can just go into starbucks, and present your butthole, to all who look at you, while also sleeping on their counter?

I mean, anybody can do pretty much anything they want at least once.

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[–] kibiz0r@midwest.social 21 points 1 day ago (6 children)

One day we will just stick with standard time.

(Or we’ll try permanent DST and experience all of the negative effects and then either go back to cycling or realize we should’ve done permanent standard.)

[–] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 5 points 1 day ago

Drop "daylight savings time" and "standard time" monikers. Use UTC offsets, and tell us what state you are in.

New York and Michigan are currently in the same time zone. When we go to permanent time, they should not be.

Michigan in UTC-4 (EDT) winter would have a sunrise after 9AM. That's fucking absurd; they should not be on UTC-4 during winter. They should be permanently on UTC-5.

New York in UTC-5 (EST) would have a summer sunrise before 4AM. That's fucking absurd. They should not be on UTC-5 in the summer. They should be permanently on UTC-4.

Maine's earliest sunset on UTC-5 will be at 3:45PM. That is criminally insane. They should permanently be on UTC-4, or maybe even UTC-3.

[–] vithigar@lemmy.ca 7 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Or we'll realize that the specific numbers are arbitrary and use UTC everywhere.

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (5 children)

You are right, but do you really want to deal with the confusion of having to wake up at some random number like 4pm UTC? And then if you finally get used to that you travel abroad and now you have to wake up at 1am? Timezones are a mess but if done correctly, they make sense because the numbers won't be arbitrary.

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[–] brsrklf@jlai.lu 17 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Where I live, even our winter time isn't close to be aligned with sun time (GMT+1 though we're basically on the Greenwich meridian). Summer time is off by two hours.

Problem is, our school/work/activity schedules have been made to adapt to that, so having days centered around actual sun midday would sound like crazy talk to people. It's just because of how we already compensated for it.

[–] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 33 points 1 day ago

So many people don't understand that the same outcome of an 'extra hour' after work could be had by shorter work hours or not having the majority of the typical office workday after noon.

9-5 was a 3|5 split. 8-5 is a 4|5 split. Treating 5 pm as the only rime to end the office workday is the fucking problem, not the sun. Changing clocks twice a year is a problem.

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 15 points 1 day ago (13 children)

Permanent daylight time gives us all of the downsides and exactly one benefit. I'm sorry you live that far North/South but that's just how the seasons and tilt of the earth work. We shouldn't be doing split time at all and we shouldn't endeavor to be an hour off the rest of the world just so commuters can drive home with the sun in their eyes.

[–] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

There is no formal requirement for your state to stay within its current timezone.

If we go to permanent DST, you can petition for your state to switch to the next timezone to the west, which would give you the same time as permanent standard time in your current timezone. Detroit, for example, is on the western edge of ET. Sunrise in winter for them would be as late as 9AM, which is ridiculous. But, if Michigan shifts to CT instead of ET, sunrise goes to 8AM, and everyone is happy.

Move yourself from EDT to CDT, which is the same as EST. Or move from CDT to MDT/CST. Or MDT to PDT/MST. Or PDT to AKDT/PST.

If you don't want to drive home with your the sun in your eyes, take a job to the east of your home.

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[–] dafo@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Ah yes, that darn hour of sunlight you lose.

Cries in 3hrs of sunlight

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[–] prunerye@slrpnk.net 38 points 1 day ago (10 children)

Good. I don't need light in the evening, I need it in the morning so I can wake up feeling rested. End DST; make standard time permanent.

[–] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 9 points 1 day ago (7 children)

Where do you live within your timezone?

I think your sentiment comes from people living on the western side of their time zone, where sunrise and sunset is an hour later than on the eastern end. On the western edge of the timezone (Detroit, for example, on the west end of the Eastern timezone), sunrise in winter could be as late as 9AM.

On the eastern end of a timezone, sunset can be as early as 3:45PM. As early as you want your sunlight, I think we can agree that a sunset before 4PM is ridiculously absurd.

If you are, indeed, on the western edge of the timezone as I think, we could adopt DST, and move you to the next zone to the west, which would put you on the same time as standard time in your current zone. You win, we win, everyone wins.

Alternatively, we could adopt Standard Time, and move people on the eastern edge to the next time zone to the east, which would put them on the same time zone as DST in their current time zone. Again, you win, we win, everyone wins.

Are you on the western edge of your timezone, or at least in the western half?

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[–] socsa@piefed.social 25 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Fuck that, use coffee like everyone else. Sun after work is literally the only time I see sun in the winter.

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (4 children)

Fuck that, use coffee like everyone else.

Fuck that, y'all are addicted to caffeine and normalising it to the point where not being a coffee craving zombie in the morning is apparently a weird thing.

Sun after work is literally the only time I see sun in the winter.

Idk what your job is but do you not have any windows anywhere? Because that's how you get burnout along with coffee addiction.

[–] Soleos@lemmy.world 24 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Fuck you morning people and normalizing waking up early in the morning to the point where sleeping until we're rested is lazy and staying up "late" is irresponsible. We adapted to your schedule using the aids we have available and now you shame us as addicts for doing what we had to do to accommodate your morning hegemony. I say, how dare you sir! /Half-joking

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

Bro I'm not even a morning person. And it's because of that I need daylight in the morning to be able to get out of bed without being like Garfield on a Monday. I hate waking up in the morning as much as you do, but I hate it a bit less if the daylight is there too.

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[–] azertyfun@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Oh I've got a window alright. It is set up perfectly right so that on the day after ST takes over I can see the sun set 6 minutes before I get off work. Sun's down, guess I can go outside now!

That is absolutely devilish. I have to get to work so I'll wake up whenever to get there. But all outdoors evening activities are, at best, a complete joke 5 months of the year because of fucking ST. Wanna take a quick jog around the neighborhood? Bad news bitch, it's pitch black outside. Here's to hoping I don't get run over by a fucking bus.

"Sun rises after work starts" is a setup for caffeine addiction, but "sun sets before work ends" is a setup for crippling alcoholism. Literally nothing to look forward to all day long, five months a year. I will not take any shit from so-called morning people about this, there is one objective truth here and it's that standard business hours being the worldwide standard that they are, ST the absolute fucking worst for office workers.

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 1 day ago (2 children)

9 to 5 jobs during winter are hell with or without DST. Blame capitalism for that.

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[–] LittleBorat3@lemmy.world 20 points 1 day ago (6 children)

No make summertime permanent so you have one hour more in the evening.. It's going to be dark in the morning no matter what.

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[–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 36 points 1 day ago (3 children)

I wish they would do this a week ago, so the kids could experience halloween how it's supposed to be, IN THE FUCKING DARK

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Tbf it not being in the dark might save some kids from being hit by a car. (Not saying that switching daylight time is the actual root of that problem...)

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[–] brsrklf@jlai.lu 17 points 1 day ago (1 children)

In France we did switch last week. Almost nobody cares about going out for trick or treat, though.

[–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 12 points 1 day ago (1 children)

sounds like you need more mcburgers to fix that problem

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[–] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 21 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Sun: Ahh, I'm ready to go to bed, it's been a long day.

Daylight Savings Time: Stay up another hour because we base our schedules around businesses. Fuck your sleep cycle!

[–] lol_idk@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 day ago (4 children)

I switched my work schedule one hour earlier starting tomorrow. I'm not sure it's going to work because I have family.

I'm staying up too late now. F standard time.

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