this post was submitted on 29 Aug 2023
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A Boring Dystopia

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[–] Badass_panda@lemmy.world 39 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I hate this term ... giving your kids money to help them start out on their own isn't nepotism, it's parenting.

Nepotism is when you violate a responsibility you have to a third party (e.g., your employer) to act impartially in their interests, in order to benefit your family.

Is the idea that parents should donate their money equally to everyone's kids? This makes no sense.

[–] Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I agree it isn't nepotism. But I think the societal expectation that parents have to help their children is a the same systemic oppression with a new face. This only applies to the well-to-do, who buy into capitalism. Give up their lives to the machine.

This power sincerely complicates coming out of the closet, dating and marrying for love, social expressions like tattoos, life choices like art instead of business. This gives us another reason to second guess whether we ought to live life for ourselves or to please our parents.

[–] Badass_panda@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I mean, it's a bit tough for me to see it that way. Having wealthy parents who can use the leg up they intend to give you in life as a way of manipulating you into doing and being what they want, and that's gotta suck.

At the same time, you can cut ties with them and you end up in the same position a lot of us start in: having to do it on your own. You've got a choice that other people don't, it's difficult for me to see that as a disadvantage.

[–] Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 year ago

the same position a lot of us start in:

yea, the starting place sucks in this country and adding cognitive dissonance to whether or not to obey my shitty parents is not something I wanna have to worry about on top of the bog standard issues about healthcare and school loans.

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Better to reign in hell than serve in heaven. The moment my parents played games with who I was going to be or they would cut me off I left them. I would pick homelessness again than give them an inch. They can go cry to their bff supply side jesus

It should definitely not be called nepotism at the individual level, but if you agree with the core premises that working should be able to grant you enough money to buy your own house, it could be argued that it is a societal kind of nepotism in that the family you have determines your most basic opportunities in life.

[–] Rooty@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

And again, the corporate media is blaming anyone but real estate companies and market speculators.

[–] Badass_panda@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Market speculators are a symptom of the problem, not the root cause. God knows "people giving their kids money for a downpayment" certainly isn't the root cause.

The foundational issue is that many high demand markets have artificial limitations on the amount of housing, and it's easier and more profitable for real estate developers to shit out mcmansions in the suburbs than denser housing where it's needed.

Demand keeps going up because the population keeps going up, while supply is focusing on fulfilling only the luxury end of the market.

[–] GivingEuropeASpook@lemm.ee 21 points 1 year ago (5 children)

God, if only people could just like pool their resources together to build homes or something...

We could even call it something like "social housing," and have it be a publically regulated service instead of treating housing as some sort of game of investment for the wealthy? No no, totally impossible...

[–] xavier666@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago

We are limited by the technology of our time

[–] droans@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

You also pretty much described what S&Ls were.

Honestly wish they could make a comeback, but we'd need to ban them from becoming national organizations. Their biggest benefits were that they helped people get houses, provided proper financial advice, and kept money local.

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[–] samus12345@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I got 20K from my parents for my down payment when I was 45 and they still had to co-sign for me to get approved. No way in hell I could have gotten the house without them.

[–] GladiusB@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] isVeryLoud@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 year ago

Land of the fee

[–] isVeryLoud@lemmy.ca 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Lucky, our parents ain't paying for shit.

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

My parents are shit. They can die in their plastic house I will be renting to death but I don't want to take a single penny from them

[–] sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works 19 points 1 year ago

That's not nepotism. Nepotism would be some land baron giving land to his kids, or a city official changing zoning to allow their family member to build something otherwise restricted.

[–] joystick@lemmy.world 18 points 1 year ago

What a clickbait title. How is giving your kids money "nepotism" ?

[–] gornar@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'll definitely be buying my children houses, with all that tons of spare money I have around. Piles of it. Yep. Sooooo much money

Seriously, who are these people that can fork out $100k to each child? I don't even have retirement savings, and I'll die on the job, with any luck! #genx

[–] samus12345@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] NABDad@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Geez, are people putting down $100k as a downpayment?!?

[–] Furbag@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

I have 100k in savings right now for a down payment, and it's still not enough to get the mortgage payments anywhere near a reasonable amount each month.

[–] littlecolt@lemm.ee 12 points 1 year ago

Don't worry, I was trying to buy a house with my parents this past year. Even if they sold their current house to help, we couldn't afford what we'd need (3 bed 2 bath) since they don't have a ton of savings and only one of them is working still.

So even with help, some of us are still too poor.

[–] negativeyoda@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

Shit. I was in my 40s and it took a generous gift from my parents to buy my first house

[–] dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 year ago

Only 40%? That seems....not true.

[–] sadreality@kbin.social 6 points 1 year ago

The country is ran by geriatric nepo babies... If you are not one of their crotch fruit, good luck, peasant! You are going to be experiencing a lot of that "free market" in your ass.

[–] SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Helping kids with their down payment isn't exactly some new thing.

[–] Cryophilia@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

The fact that it's such a large percentage of new home owners is a new thing

It's the only way to afford a home anymore

[–] SeaJ@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago

My wife and I had enough for a down-payment but my parents leaning me $10k at a lower rate was helpful, vitally getting rid of the PMI quicker.

[–] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 4 points 1 year ago

Lol, I had to do the same in 2008. Nothing's changed. Except it's only gotten more expensive

[–] Fedizen@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

only 40%, I guess this isnt tracking people who have no show jobs for their family business

[–] BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

Nothing is going to fundamentally change so long as housing supply drastically falls short of the demand. There's no way to escape the core issue that we don't have enough housing units in the places people want to live, and so the units that are available are going to go to the wealthiest people seeking them.

[–] falinter@midwest.social 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Obama (or Illinois?) gave me 10k down payment in 2009 and I got a tiny townhome at 23 right after I got a job outta college. I stayed in it for 10 years and traded it in for a bigger house like a crab after I got married.

I was not money conscious at the time but my dad pretty much forced me to get a house if I had the means. I'm glad he did.

So I guess I was also gifted my down payment from my parents and other tax payers parents.

[–] sj_zero@lotide.fbxl.net 1 points 1 year ago

I think that there's two things to keep in mind when buying a house:

the first is that notwithstanding rising interest rates which you especially in America should be able to mitigate with long-term mortgage rates, it locks your cost of housing in time. What you pay for a house is going to be what you pay for house. And so that's obviously a bit of a problem with house prices go down, but if they go sideways you're fine and if they go way out like they have it's really good.

But the second part of that is that people need to buy a house that they can actually afford because the cost of their house is stuck in time and so if you buy something really expensive and it's never really not expensive for you, then you have just made a long-term commitment to something that you can't really afford.

In canada, many mortgages are variable rate, and of the fixed rate options the longest lock in that most people do is 5 years. Once you start rising above that, the cost of money goes up considerably. In spite of that, I locked in at a decent rate in 2020 for 10 years which is virtually unheard of up here, and reduce my amortization by 10 years. I'm not going to lie, I am bragging. Really proud of myself for correctly predicting exactly what was going to happen in spite of every politician in central banker assuring me that it wasn't going to happen.

[–] Echo71Niner@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Almost reads like the author is fucking mad other people have rich parents who have the brains to help the very humans they created and brought into this life.

[–] conditional_soup@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Problem is that this is antithetical to much of the grandstanding that we do about the beauty and efficiency and yadda yadda of free markets. The narrative is, of course, that anyone can succeed wholly on their own merit in a free market economy if they just try hard enough, and if you're not succeeding, then you're obviously just not trying. Yet, here we've got data that throws an asterisk into the mix and says that if you want to buy a house, you're probably going to need to have all three of:

  • parents

  • who have money

  • and are willing to share it with you.

None of which any individual is in any kind of control of. You can't tryhard your way into having wealthy parents that are happy to buy things for you, so now we're forced to re-examine the system and whether you really can succeed just by trying hard. The answer is more nuanced, but it boils down to luck. Yes, it is possible, given the right circumstances, that hard work can lead to success. In the overwhelming majority of cases, however, hard work means squat compared to luck. Other things are much more critical to success in our economic system, including owning assets, having powerful connections, and having the right skillset combined with the right opportunities, and most of those things boil down to luck.

I'm mortgaging a house, but I'm not delusional enough to believe that luck didn't play a role. We got very, very lucky to have the right opportunities at the right time, as well as to have one parent with the money and willingness to share it to help us get into our starter home. Failing one of those, which would have been simple enough to have failed, we'd still be renting and living in a much worse financial situation, both in terms of monthly bills and net worth. We worked for it, yes, but pulling on your bootstraps isn't enough, and it's time to stop pretending that it is. It hasn't been enough for a long time, and I can't fathom that it ever was the case.

[–] Shurimal@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

hard work means squat compared to luck

More often than not the only rewards for hard work is more work and ruined health.

[–] Zorque@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

other people have rich parents who have the brains

*bank accounts

I dont know why you're conflating throwing money at your children with intelligence. If anything, it'd be empathy over brainpower.

[–] Echo71Niner@lemm.ee -4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Actually it's brain power, to not allow the humans they created, to be subjected, to insane rent costs for the rest of their lives.

[–] Alto@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Nah you're right, the parents who simply can't afford it are just dumb

Fucking idiot

[–] Echo71Niner@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago

There are a lot of fucking idiots who can not make money let alone manage money creating human beings and than claim GOD created them, they are idiots.

[–] Zorque@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

Again... empathy, not brain power.

[–] Amaltheamannen@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 year ago

More like the problem is only people with rich parents can now afford owning a house. It's disgusting.

[–] WeAllKnowWhyWereHere@lemmynsfw.com 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ok but let’s stop blaming people for buying places to live and recognize that a larger problem is corporations buying properties by the dozens and using them as sky-high rentals or just a place to park money.

[–] what@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm okay with blaming nepotism. I also want to point out the other problem is the vast majority of new housing builds in cities is entirely luxury condos. You can't fix a supply and demand issue if you never address supply.

[–] glimse@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Calling that nepotism is a stretch imo. There is nothing wrong with borrowing money from your parents for a down payment just like there's nothing wrong with your parents paying your tuition.

The problem you highlighted - luxury development - is a significantly bigger issue. And that's less of an issue than corporate landlords.

Then there's private rentals which I'd say is the biggest factor involving individuals (not companies)

But a 28 year old borrowing money from dad is a drop in the bucket. It feels unfair to me to place any blame on them at all

[–] June@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

I got money from my ex’s family to buy my house in my 30’s.

[–] Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 year ago

Lmfaooooo Bruhhhh I'm under 30 and I'm living with my parent rather than getting help moving out.

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