I honestly think that music did more to hurt the show than anything else. It was the musical equivalent of starting EVERY EPISODE with a voiceover saying: "we hate all that old star trek. This is the new WB Network Star Trek, with 70% more down home, Midwestern American values! Yeehaw!"
this post was submitted on 23 Aug 2023
103 points (95.6% liked)
Star Trek
10608 readers
100 users here now
r/startrek: The Next Generation
Star Trek news and discussion. No slash fic...
Maybe a little slash fic.
New to Star Trek and wondering where to start?
Rules
1 Be constructive
All posts/comments must be thoughtful and balanced.
2 Be welcoming
It is important that everyone from newbies to OG Trekkers feel welcome, no matter their gender, sexual orientation, religion or race.
3 Be truthful
All posts/comments must be factually accurate and verifiable. We are not a place for gossip, rumors, or manipulative or misleading content.
4 Be nice
If a polite way cannot be found to phrase what it is you want to say, don't say anything at all. Insulting or disparaging remarks about any human being are expressly not allowed.
5 Spoilers
Utilize the spoiler system for any and all spoilers relating to the most recently-aired episodes, as well as previews for upcoming episodes. There is no formal spoiler protection for episodes/films after they have been available for approximately one week.
6 Keep on-topic
All submissions must be directly about the Star Trek franchise (the shows, movies, books etc.). Off-topic discussions are welcome at c/quarks.
7 Meta
Questions and concerns about moderator actions should be brought forward via DM.
Upcoming Episodes
| Date | Episode | Title |
|---|---|---|
| 11-21 | LD 5x06 | "Of Gods and Angles" |
| 11-28 | LD 5x07 | "Fully Dilated" |
| 12-05 | LD 5x08 | "Upper Decks" |
| 12-12 | LD 5x09 | "Fissue Quest" |
| 12-19 | LD 5x10 | "The New Next Generation" |
In Production
Strange New Worlds (2025)
Section 31 (2025-01-24)
Starfleet Academy (TBA)
In Development
Untitled comedy series
Wondering where to stream a series? Check here.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Gotta love how after hearing everyone complain about how bad it was, they doubled down and made a “jazzy” version for later seasons.
Yep ... completely agree and I've said the same before. Whether the producers liked it or not, the opening and its vibe is part of Trek. If you want to do a different kind of show ... cool ... but you've gotta meet fans somewhere in the middle. Starting the whole thing off with a complete undoing of the whole vibe of the thing is not the right way to meet fans in the middle.
I'm sure I'm not alone in this, but when I first saw enterprise, I honestly thought it was a cheap rip off that was bound to get sued, and the song was a huuuuge part in the that impression. "No Star Trek would start with that song, this is some weird corporatised shit".
And the effect of that ... to this day, even though I didn't mind ENT S4, I don't count it as part of (my) Trek (it also did particularly bad on the bechdel test). And to this day, even with new-Trek, we're struggling to get new series that push Trek forward without being nostalgia driven, a reboot, prequel or maybe even all of the above (looking at you SNW!). Lower Decks, in this way, really does stand out (Prodigy too, though I haven't seen it).
people did react that way, but I liked the song well enough, and grew to like it more.
It's like root beer. The worst part is after a while you actually start to like it.
It's... Insidious.
I get what they were going for with the song, but it's a swing and a miss for me. I think the opening credits montage fits perfectly with the show, but not the song. When I watch ENT, the only time I don't mute the sound during the opening credits is for "In a Mirror, Darkly, Parts 1 and 2."
" ... another 'space theme for nerds,' so to speak ... "
Not so to speak. Exactly that. Give me the orchestral story telling. Give me that epic space theme.
I agree, the montage is really good. Showing the progression of flight through history works very well with Treks ideal of advancement.
I don't hate it. I hate Nazis. I don't hate the theme song from 'Enterprise.'
¿Por qué no los dos?
stubbed toe ---> ENT theme song ---->\ 10K light-years \---> Nazis.
Can't blame someone for wanting to use appropriately strong words for appropriately strong feelings.
Anyone have good insights on the downfall of TNG-era Trek?
With Enterprise and Nemesis, it feels to me like the kind of situation where all the good people left and the person in charge (or Berman) didn’t know how much their success was because of the good people.
And so they run with their ideas, thinking they’re good and indifferent to the pushback from their underlings.
Is that what happened?
EDIT: So my vague guess as to what would have constituted "all the good people left" would have been Michael Piller, Jeri Taylor (and maybe Ronald D Moore counts too?) leaving. I just checked, and it seems by about Voyager S3/4, they'd both more or less left Trek, and, by the time Enterprise comes around, I'm guessing it was just Berman and Braga who'd stuck around, and, I'd also guess they really didn't have much of a role in giving (or understanding) the TNG era qualities that made it good.
Two words Rick Berman
Can you expound on those words? I don’t know anything about him, other than his name is in the credits.
Can you expound on those words? I don’t know anything about him, other than his name is in the credits.
#Check out
After Roddenberry and his wife passed there was no one to reinforce the ideals that drove Trek.
DS9 was arguably anti-Trek, or at least seriously questioned the idea of the Federation as a force for only good in the realpolitik of the Alpha Quadrant.
I feel like the problem with Voyager and Enterprise was more that the writing wasn't as good.
This again. Can we just leave this be for good? Some people like it, some people don't, potentially more people rather do not like it. That is it. Not a single one of these articles is ever adding anything more to the discussion.
This article added quite a bit to the discussion. For one, U2’s beautiful day was also considered, as was a semi-operatic song performed by Russell Watson. It’s not simply a rehash of the hate it/love arguments. I encourage you to read it.
I posted this because it is incorporating the oral history, and puts to bed some unfounded speculation.
The full books are reportedly excellent, but not that many of us have read them as yet.
And no matter how great some fans found it, the song really contributed to the perception that the franchise shifted to be very American oriented over the course of Berman’s leadership. It was a real barrier to growing the international audience.
I'm happy to read this post. Its all new information to me.
Right, so I didn’t actually mind the original ENT theme at all during my rewatch earlier this year. Far worse was the outro credits which were deeply jarring every single time.
The revamped theme is appalling though, it’s doubling down on everything that put people off about the original and it’s far, far worse.
Indeed. While I would have preferred an orchestral piece, the intro theme for Seasons 1 and 2 was jarring, but not bad. When they updated it for S3 and 4 it was absolute garbage.
The one-shot intro for the mirror universe episode was absolutely fantastic though. They should have stuck with that one, or Archer's Theme, which has an appropriately Star Trek optimism to it, while still being a bit "pop"-y.
I'm not sure if you have seen archers theme played with the intro video, but the music lines up with the scenes very well. I'd bet that it was made as the opening credits scene.
I've seen that, although I think it was a fan video and not any official creation. I liked it very much. It would have made a better introduction for sure.
I’m sure it was a fan creation. It’s just that it aligned so well I could see the computer using that footage when making archers theme.
I hated it at first.
Then I grew to love it.
The show is about humanity taking it's first steps into the wider galactic community, and the song is both about a journey but also less refined than other star trek intros, just like Starfleet is a less refined version of what we are used to.
🤷
I hated it until they changed it in season 2 or 3 and then I realized that I hated the new version even more and in retrospect the original wasn't quite that bad.
If I'm not mistaken, that's a classic sign of Stockholm Syndrome. But what do I know, it's been a long road...
It grew on me. It fit the intended mood of the show, at least until it got bogged down in time fuckery. 
Enterprise would have been a lot better if they introduced the Romulans as the big bad in the pilot instead of the temporal cold war bullshit.
Yeah, I agree it was quite an odd pairing and it never quite sat right with me. I get the intent/meaning, but honestly it stands out as just… not fitting with the trek “theme.”
I love this intro and also Ent S3 and S4 is the only Trek that can compete with DS9, fight me.
Bartender? This guy has clearly had enough, he's just going around saying extremely inflamatory things.
Season 4, IMHO, is among the best of all Star Trek. The Vulcan bombing 3 parter alone was such a great storyline, playing off of plot lines going all the way back to the first episode.
Aw, I liked it :c
The first season version, absolutely, but the seasons after they changed it to the acoustic version, much much better.
It’s actually pretty fun when you play it back double speed, chipmunk style.
I love that my love of Enterprise alienates me from the majority of the fan base.
Season 4 is objectively the best season of any Trek.
I'll back you up, brother. Season 4 had some of the highest highs.
The Archer-Shran arc not only started to culminate (a 5th season would have fucking rocked) but was one of the best ways of telling the story of the early federation. The personal arc from enemies to allies demonstrated humanity forming alliances better than any other arc in Star Trek.
I 100% agree.
I always loved the intro music, and never knew who it was from or how it was selected. It is a very optimistic song, and I think that's what Star Trek is about as well.
We all cringe, Braga. You're not special
The problem with Enterprise's theme is that it undermines the fundamental principles the series had established in every other show. The song along with its imagery may feel like it's fitting for "mankind stepping into the larger galaxy", but it does so at great expense. Everything about that opening is anthropocentric. It's all about humanity and Earth. The show is every bit as broad as its predecessors, but the opening seems to feel like the poster child for HFY fiction. It's jarring.