this post was submitted on 25 Mar 2024
154 points (88.1% liked)

Europe

8484 readers
1 users here now

News/Interesting Stories/Beautiful Pictures from Europe 🇪🇺

(Current banner: Thunder mountain, Germany, 🇩🇪 ) Feel free to post submissions for banner pictures

Rules

(This list is obviously incomplete, but it will get expanded when necessary)

  1. Be nice to each other (e.g. No direct insults against each other);
  2. No racism, antisemitism, dehumanisation of minorities or glorification of National Socialism allowed;
  3. No posts linking to mis-information funded by foreign states or billionaires.

Also check out !yurop@lemm.ee

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
poVoq@slrpnk.net
154
‘Free speech is a facade’: how Gaza war has deepened divisions in German arts world (www.theguardian.com)
submitted 7 months ago by 0x815@feddit.de to c/europe@feddit.de
82 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

Less than 10 years ago, Germany, and especially Berlin, was held up as a beacon of openness and inclusivity in a western world rocked by Brexit and Donald Trump. Angela Merkel’s decision to take in thousands of refugees displaced by the war in Syria boosted her country’s reputation in progressive circles, with many international artists and academics choosing to make the German capital their new home.

Yet the conflict in the Middle East is showing Germany in a new light, highlighting fissures in society and the arts world that until now had been easier to ignore.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] muelltonne@feddit.de 13 points 7 months ago (4 children)

You really should recheck your sources. F.e. this case here

The state of Berlin is now trying to pass a law to allow universities to exmatriculate students on “behavioural” grounds (aka political stances).

is not "behavioural grounds", but because some students beat up a jewish student for political reasons and the university wasn't allowed to expell them due to legal reasons.

[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 30 points 7 months ago (4 children)

If they beat up someone, they should be charged with the crime they did. Why do new crimes need to be invented?

[–] geissi@feddit.de 4 points 7 months ago

Criminal prosecution is not done by universities so if universities want to act on this they need a different legal basis for that.

[–] Turun@feddit.de 3 points 7 months ago

Why do new crimes need to be invented?

This is not at all what they are saying. Such a new law would not introduce a new crime, but be an amendment to the university's rules so that they are allowed to expel students who committed certain crimes before.

[–] gian@lemmy.grys.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Maybe more than a new crime it should be an aggravating circumstance. Beating someone for some petty reason and beating someone for political/religoius reasons are different in gravity.

[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 6 points 7 months ago

It already is apparently: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_crime#Germany

The German Criminal Code does not have hate crime legislation, instead, it criminalizes hate speech under a number of different laws, including Volksverhetzung. In the German legal framework motivation is not taken into account while identifying the element of the offence. However, within the sentencing procedure the judge can define certain principles for determining punishment. In section 46 of the German Criminal Code it is stated that "the motives and aims of the perpetrator; the state of mind reflected in the act and the willfulness involved in its commission"[44] can be taken into consideration when determining the punishment; under this statute, hate and bias have been taken into consideration in sentencing in past cases.[45]

[–] crispy_kilt@feddit.de 1 points 7 months ago

Because a hate crime is different offence from a "normal" crime, duh

[–] febra@lemmy.world 14 points 7 months ago

Yeah, it will definitely not get used against activists. Beating people up is illegal. The persons involved in such things should be handled by the authorities. With that being said, trading your rights for """security""" has always proven to be a stupid idea. Giving universities this power, especially given their track record of shooting down any kind of political dissent, will only end up in power hungry individuals abusing it.

[–] tryptaminev@feddit.de 9 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

The victim in that assault case has been shoving and grabbing students at the university before. That is of course much less severe than how he was beaten up, but in that discussion about throwing out students for violent behaviour that was conveniently ignored.

The whole discussion only started when he was attacked and it was about denying education to pro Palestinian and in particular Arab and other migrant sudents. It was headed among others by the racist major of Berlin (major in this case is also the head of the state government) who just a year ago won an election on the grounds of demanding police to release the names of suspect teenagers. This demand was made so the public could decide based on the names, if those suspects were "real Germans" instead of maybe "foreigners with a German passport". This is far-right nationalist ideology and primitive racism.

So it is clear what goals are aimed at with the demand to throw students out of universities if they are suspect of a crime. If it would be put in place it would be used to remove "foreigners" from universities, not to remove "good kids who have made a mistake".

[–] muelltonne@feddit.de 1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

What I want to say: Those cases are complex, have a lot of nuance and it is totally not ok that @febra@lemmy.world is going around and doing propaganda totally distorting the complexity of those cases.

[–] tryptaminev@feddit.de 5 points 7 months ago

But in that complexity it is also not yet clear, if the attack was an actual hate crime, with the goal to harm the victim because he is jewish.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

some students beat up a jewish student for political reasons and the university wasn't allowed to expell them due to legal reasons

You mean they can't expel students for bigotry-related violence? I call bullshit.

[–] tryptaminev@feddit.de 15 points 7 months ago (1 children)

They can't expel people for things they do off campus. That is true. However it also shouldn't be the case, as we had our wave of "red scare" persecutions of people in the 70s, destroying peoples lives based on often farbicated charges against people who were considered "too left".

Denying people access to education based on criminal charges is a slippery slope and in the current environment it is likely, that these will solely be used for political persecution.

Also it should be noted that the claim, that the attack was bigotry related is made by the victim and his supporters, with the victim having a history of violently engaging pro palestinian protestors on campus, ripping off posters that remembered killed palestinian women and children and repeatedly demanded all pro palestinian voices to be banned from campus.

The police didnt classify it as a hate crime so far and the claims of it being a hate crime are made on the allegation that jewishness and pro-israel and pro-zionism stances are identical. (Which is in itself antisemtic and used to repress jewish people in Germany who are critical of zionism)

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 7 points 7 months ago

Denying people access to education based on criminal charges is a slippery slope and in the current environment it is likely, that these will solely be used for political persecution.

Didn't consider that. That's an excellent point.

Also it should be noted that the claim, that the attack was bigotry related is made by the victim and his supporters, with the victim having a history of violently engaging pro palestinian protestors on campus, ripping off posters that remembered killed palestinian women and children and repeatedly demanded all pro palestinian voices to be banned from campus.

Yeah. Knowing that, it DOES stink..

that jewishness and pro-israel and pro-zionism stances are identical. (Which is in itself antisemtic and used to repress jewish people in Germany who are critical of zionism)

Absolutely.

[–] muelltonne@feddit.de 3 points 7 months ago (1 children)

You might call bullshit, it is bullshit, but sadly it is a fact. See this german article here: https://www.rbb24.de/politik/beitrag/2024/02/berlin-hochschulgesetz-universitaet-gewalttaeter-sanktionen.html

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 4 points 7 months ago (1 children)

My school German is quite rusty, you wouldn't happen to have an English language article?

[–] photonic_sorcerer@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 7 months ago (1 children)

DeepL

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

DeepL? What's that?

[–] AlexS@feddit.de 5 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Best online translator in town. Better than Google.

DeepL.com

App

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 0 points 7 months ago

Ah ok, thanks!