this post was submitted on 02 Sep 2023
504 points (83.9% liked)
Memes
45309 readers
2269 users here now
Rules:
- Be civil and nice.
- Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Socialism is when the government does stuff
Uh, yeah? Socialism is a product or service provided by a government agency at a reduced or waived price. The products and services in question don't just happen.
Trying to explain the world economic state to the extremists on both sides of the political spectrum. Because they don't seem to understand mass media lied about the definitions of various political ideologies. Sush.
You are literally saying something that is so thoroughly absurd it is a well known meme used to make fun of people who don't know what they're talking about.
Clip of the most famous example of the meme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgiC8YfytDw
Lecture the clip is from (that you could learn a lot from): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysZC0JOYYWw
Look, ignorance is not a crime. But you really are painfully ignorant about the topic you are claiming to explain and you would do well to learn more before presuming to educate "extremists on both sides." Your comments are so lacking in self awareness and so cringe that I'm half convinced this is a bit.
Edit: So after a refresh of the thread I read more of your comments and I'm glad to see you're willing to learn and discuss. Here is another good introduction point that's been well received by a lot of people beginning to look beyond the buzzwords and genuinely learn: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKsygbNLT4 Actually, the same could be said for about every video on that channel (Second Thought).
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=rgiC8YfytDw
https://piped.video/watch?v=ysZC0JOYYWw
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
Socialism is an economic system defined by production of goods and services according to their need, in contrast to capitalism where they're produced for profit. Two totally different, incompatible systems
Okay, then I'm willing to admit fault but... Which is it? Worker control of production, or production according to need?
Or are you honestly going to tell me you think Collectivism (worker control of government and economy) or Communism (according to need and with no profit-making allowed) are the only forms that socialism takes?
Not saying you're wrong, only that conflicting definitions do not help your cases, Cynetri and GreenTeaRedFlag.
These end up being the same thing, that is sort of the point of capitalism going away. The profit motive is disconnected from human utility.
Yea i kinda forgot the workers control part whoops
Honestly, why not just peg the value of 100 of a a currency to the energy used to create a loaf of bread? Then bread will always cost close to 100 and other products will be priced according to energy and not speculation. The recipe would need to be standardized and compared but not automatically equivocated to supermarket/bakery/homemade bread, and changing it once the hypothetical currency is live would not be an option, but you're asking to replace the entire capitalist economy so I can only hope you understand a revolution doesn't come without risk and has never truly succeeded yet for anyone ever.
Markets aren't that efficient compared to planning. There is a reason why firms nowadays work off of a bastardized descendent of Cybersyn.
Tell that to Cubans, who had a longer life expectancy than people than the US even with the blockade before Trump intensified the blockade.
I just said, for anyone. Democracies included. This isn't about who did what, it's about how everyone has failed to create everlasting utopia and I'm sick of people assuming a given political system will ever fix any problem on its own.
That might work. Really it isn't that hard. Most societies through history have practiced some form of social production. Without the fear and lie nation of capitlaism the desire to do good and not live in a bad place has been drive enough to make things work.
no it isn't. socialism is worker control of the means of production.
Okay, then I'm willing to admit fault but... Which is it? Worker control of production, or production according to need?
Or are you honestly going to tell me you think Collectivism (worker control of government and economy) or Communism (according to need and with no profit-making allowed) are the only forms that socialism takes?
Not saying you're wrong, only that conflicting definitions do not help your cases, Cynetri and GreenTeaRedFlag.
The historical reality is that the word’s meaning has changed over time and the meaning currently being used by GreenTeaRedFlag has also changed words. There used to be “social democrats” who would be more recognizable as Marxists nowadays and who bear little resemblance to what we call them nowadays.
That actually explains a lot, thank you. I'm just going to duck out now then since clearly I walked into a minefield of conflicting historical definitions.
That’s fair. For what it’s worth, I don’t know any socialist schools of thought which define socialism as equivalent to government social spending.
No need to reply since you’re ducking out, but if you don’t mind me offering a couple videos on the subject of central planning, these are well done and measured analyses in my opinion:
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/RJLA2_Ho7X0?si=BzV34yf_M1HnfUVO
https://piped.video/pDSZRkhynXU?si=QriJLFRzciVLZvGd
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
Good bot
Your Aquarium analogy might actually be the most obtuse, word salad-y, revisionist nonsense I’ve read in years; and your definition of socialism is just flat out wrong