I really hope they introduce a year of social service. No matter if military, police or healthcare, everyone should experience what it feels to serve society at least once.

An interesting aspect I didn't think of so far was recently brought by German news influencer LeFloid: It adds people to the mix of police and military that wouldn't normally be there. The far-left tend to avoid them, while the far-right embraces them. This creates a dangerous imbalance between left and right views in these structures and opens up room for radicalisation.

[–] rottingleaf@lemmy.zip 7 points 8 months ago

Correct. (Only it goes both ways - the left do get influenced by that mix during their service.)

[–] aluminium@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago

Terrible Idea - in Austria many young men do a 9 month long social service instead of military service and many often get treated like shit.

[–] citizen@normalcity.life 2 points 8 months ago

Oh yea I can't wait to be jailed and fined if i don't want to be forced to serve for free a country that destroy the environment to mine lignite and sell weapons to saudi arabia.

[–] LemmyHead@lemmy.ml 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I'm totally against the military part. It's just elite people deciding on the lives of people that are not in power. And when the time is right, they'll take away your freedom of choice and mandate you to join a war. My body my rules.

[–] bouh@lemmy.world 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

You can't have a country without a military to defend it.

[–] LemmyHead@lemmy.ml 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (4 children)

That's why people join the military voluntarily and get paid for it. My statement was only against forced military service.

Anything mandatory generally is ridiculous and counterproductive. By forcing people to do community service won't necessarily make them better citizens either. E.g. in South Korea, a lot of people got a trauma from it because (extreme) bullying is very present there. There's a good documentary about it.

[–] bouh@lemmy.world 2 points 8 months ago

Ukraine shows that in time of war conscription is necessary.

But indeed in peaceful and powerful countries it's usually requested by conservative for the worst reasons possible, and I think it mostly feeds fascism. Community service is mostly the same. It's forced labour which is akin to slavery. Conservative like those things because they want to teach obedience and respect, but they are idiots.

Still, conscription is necessary in some conditions, and I wouldn't oppose it on principle. In France it was stopped because it was expensive and no war was in sight. Time changed and we still have atomic bombs, so in this case I guess it's quite useless.

But then it asks the question of who the army is defending. With conservative, racists and other fascist friends making most of the police and the army I feel like it's becoming dangerous. Maybe the army should be more representative of all people. But how can you do it without forcing people? And how do you prevent the army from being a corporation with its own interests and views otherwise?

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[–] starflower@lemmy.blahaj.zone 29 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Since taking office at the beginning of 2023, Defense Minister Boris Pistorius has been thinking about ways to make the Bundeswehr more attractive as a career.

No amount of money or benefits will ever make me a government's boot licker. Sorry, not sorry

[–] Ooops@kbin.social 13 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (3 children)

Maybe you personally. But money would actually solve all their problems.

All they provide today is a shitty job with bad pay and no future prospects.

They are not finding enough soldiers because all these soft modern young adults are too selfish for that job, just like companies find no employees because those spoiled brats are too lazy to work. Obviously none of it has to do with not providing reasonable payments of course. So forced labor is the the proposed solution.

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[–] NIB@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago

So what is the alternative? Let any authoritarian asshole who has managed to convince many boot lickers to join him, take over your country?

[–] sbv@sh.itjust.works 16 points 8 months ago

cold war 2.0 is as shitty as the first one

[–] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 11 points 8 months ago (1 children)

TIL they had that.

[–] airportline@lemmy.ml 8 points 8 months ago

Austria still does

[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 7 points 8 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:

Since taking office at the beginning of 2023, Defense Minister Boris Pistorius has been thinking about ways to make the Bundeswehr more attractive as a career.

As journalist and defense and security policy expert Thomas Wiegold told DW: "A major frustration in the Bundeswehr is the bureaucracy.

When Pistorius floated his ideas about conscription in December, he faced a barrage of criticism, including from within his own center-left Social Democratic Party (SPD).

Party co-chair Saskia Esken said it would be impossible to implement mandatory recruitment on an ad hoc basis "because the training units required for this are no longer available."

"The reintroduction of compulsory service would be a serious encroachment on the freedom of young people who want to orient themselves professionally," FDP parliamentary group leader Christian Dürr warned in an interview with the Funke Mediengruppe.

"Who would have thought around two years ago that the Bundestag would decide on setting up a special fund of €100 billion for the Bundeswehr against the backdrop of a Russian war of aggression?"

The original article contains 900 words, the summary contains 171 words. Saved 81%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] citizen@normalcity.life 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/emma-goldman-preparedness-the-road-to-universal-slaughter

https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/emma-goldman-speeches-against-conscription

[–] Lols@lemm.ee 4 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (7 children)

forced labour is slavery

maybe folks would sign up to protect their country if they thought it deserved to be protected, or was doing anything for them

[–] xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Do you say the same about jury duty?

In my opinion, as long as the system for who is required to participate is fair and equitable, then it's fair to consider it a civil duty.

[–] Lols@lemm.ee 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (2 children)

the system for who is required to participate has practically never been fair and equitable, jury duty is not comparable to military service, and forced labour is slavery

civil jury duty is a really weird example to use anyway, since civil jury trials are practically non existent outside the USA

[–] xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

practically never

Soooo... sometimes.

Jury duty is also compulsory labour.

[–] Lols@lemm.ee 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (4 children)

forced labour is slavery

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[–] xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 8 months ago

The number of people who think conscription is just getting ferried to a frontline with a sandwich and a thumbs up is baffling.

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