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If anyone else comes here - go watch the posted video but stay away from this comment section.
I have absolutely no idea how such a level-headed and well-put-together speech appealing at human decency and respect towards each other devolved into such a vile comment section.
I assume most of the commenters either didn't watch the video or purposefully ignored its content to instead incite more hate.
Because Habeck did not confirm their biases.
commenters be biased and brownpilled π
what is wrong with brown pilled :( Isn't silent quitting the sane thing to do?
Very good and level headed comment, rightfully met with wide acclaim across the political landscape in Germany.
I posted this before as an reply, but I think this is relevant for everyone: Hamas doubles down and says it was only the first October 7 attack of many to come
~~This could have been expressed in a single sentence: The fact that Israel is punishing all citizens of Ghaza for Hamas attacks does not mean that Germans should act the same towards the Jews (but we don't mind if you do towards Iranians and such). Tragic.~~
This is objectively false.
Habeck says in the video that he has seen a terrifying growth in antisemitism in Germany where members of the Jewish faith are scared to leave the house on their own or publicly display religious symbols due to open hostility. He talks about a responsibility of Germans due to the central role in the holocaust but also how the Islamic world has not distanced itself enough from the atrocities committed by the hamas. He even remarked that one doesn't have to agree with some of Israel's politics - even explicitly naming the settlements in the Gaza / West Bank region - but that this should not be any excuse for antisemitism.
I will say again what I said in another comment - The video is an appeal to human decency and respect. Shame on you for willfully and stubbornly ignoring that and derailing the conversation to incite further hate.
Yes, life in Gaza is life in poverty without prospects for the future. Yes, the settler movement in the West Bank is fomenting discord and robs the Palestinians of hope and rights and, increasingly, lives. And the suffering of the civilian population now at war is a fact, a terrible fact.
You are right and I am wrong I haven't read the whole video. I am ashamed. Insert whichever invective you like - I have few. There is no excuse.
I respect you for admitting you were wrong. That takes courage.
Also maybe it wasn't smart leaving that part out of my reply.
Thanks for acknowledging your mistakes. We should all learn from this post.
Donβt feed the troll
He's clarifying blatant disinformation (something the Greens suffering a lot of thanks to various propaganda campaigns against them). A lot of people might read it and take their comment for granted.
Unfortunately it's hard to tell trolls apart from real people in here.
It somewhat reminds me of the height of covid in online discussions - people turn off their brains and fall back on basic emotions and empty phrases.
Doesn't matter if it is his actual opinion or not. You still helped to clarify disinformation that someone might've just believed.
I have dealt with those people quite often on Lemmy.ml and even Lemmy.world
They are not here to discuss. They are here to spread hate and do their virtue signaling to Hamas apologists - because most of the time they are Hamas supporters themselves.
I haven't seen it yet, so I don't know if he said more than what you write.
What you describe is that he asks of Muslims everywhere to identify with Hamas and then to distance themselves from them. Does he address growing anti-muslim racism? Because from what you write it indeed sounds as if he appeals to human decency towards one side while ignoring the other.
No one except antisemites blames Jews for what Israel does, but on the other hand the Islamic world is blamed for Hamas terror and asked to distance themselves from it. Those are double standards.
So instead of writing long texts, you maybe should watch the video instead of accusing him of being βone sidedβ?
Call out the genocide. Looking away while saying "never again" is the utter peak of cynicism. You and your government are complicit in this genocide. Step down.
Habeck literally calls out both sides wrongdoings instead of ignoring one for the other, while differentiating Hamas & Palestinians, and the Israeli government & Jews as a whole. Something a lot of people wanted from other leaders & countries as well. But you do you with your anti-Green propaganda shit.
So Germany is willing to look the other way as Israel is butchering thousands of innocents. The fact that I even voted for this guy's party..
You should volunteer yourself as a human shield for Hamas then, so a Palestinian doesnβt have to be a human shield for Hamas.
Human shield or not, Israel is killing innocent people using this disgusting excuse. If a terrorist would take your family hostage I'm sure you'd be more than happy to have Israel airstrike all of them.
Donβt tell us what you DONβT want, tell us what you DO want: How would you personally handle this situation while securing the Israeli AND the Palestinian people. And by securing I mean not only temporary, but permanently.
But please donβt pretend that you actually could negotiate a peace with Hamas.
Israel is killing innocent people
Basically describing every war ever. Why also war should be avoided, which is very possible if involved people in power are interested in it, which does not seems to be the case on either side.
We all know you didn't.
How is that? I'm a gay, partly jewish guy, that is strongly left leaning and cares a lot about the climate and social issues. I have voted for the green party. I agree with their stance on Ukraine and Russia, which is why I am so confused by their stance on Israel. I never expected them to act in such a way. I agree with their climate policy. I agree with their urbanism policies. But the complete disregard they have shown towards palestinian lives is simply disgusting. But whatever, you tell me who I voted for.
Yes, this bullshit definitely makes your story and disinformation even more believable. You understand that people can actually check his words for themselves, right?
Look. I went and listened to the speech again, because I don't want people to claim that I'm spreading misinformation here.
What I gathered from his speech, the main points:
I'd rather have a Germany that works towards a humanitarian solution, not a Germany that is straight up supporting some very horrible people and supports the US in blocking any kind of UN intervention. I don't mind calling out antisemitism, I've been doing that my entire life. And I have read more than enough books on jewish history, dug through archives to learn about my great great grandparents that died in the holocaust, and much more. I don't mind calling out terrorism either, every sane human should. But I very much mind this kind of rhetoric towards unconditional support for a far-right expansionist regime. Especially one represented by a far-right religious zionist coalition, that claims that some biblical lands that currently happen to be under palestinian control should be owned by them because their book says so. Here you can read more about them. Is this really who we want to throw our unconditional support at? A cabinet filled with people like Itamar Ben-Gvir that literally has a poster of a terrorist that killed a bunch of people in his office? The guy that put a billbioard of arab opposition politicians in a town and called for their expulsion? Man I'm so over this. Believe what you want. I voted green for a reason. Now I don't know who to vote for anymore. I sure as hell don't want to vote for the putinists further to the left, and the more to the right you go than the green party the worse it gets.
@febra @DarkThoughts First of, kudos for taking the time to watch the entire thing and writing a comprehensive answer. It's stuff like this that makes me appreciate this platform. So a sincere thanks.
Two, actual substance: For all its faults and sometimes procecutable actions I dont think IsraΓ«l is pursuing the eradication of the Palestine people, this as opposed to the attempted eradication of the Israelie AND Jewish (Kindly note the two of them) populace by Hamas/Hezbollah/ISIS/etc. Survival
I used to have a very similar opinion up until the far-right has hijacked the Israeli government, and thereby officially making it state policy that the Land of Israel is first and foremost jewish. That the government should first and foremost work by jewish laws and traditions. That the state policy will be that of settling all the jewish lands, and keep in mind, we're talking about the ultraorthodox religious zionist coalition here, so those lands are the ones described in the holy texts. This means settling even in territories that currently count as palestinian. This government has made expansionism state policy. This same government talks a lot about the jewish identity, promoting that. All of these policies do not scream diversity to me in any way shape or form, and they surely don't seem intended to make the lives of non jews easier. "The government will preserve the Jewish character of the state". Settlements are mentioned everywhere throughout their official policy.
Please, I beg you to go read that link. It's not even from a weird anti-Israel website. It's on the Times of Israel website. We are looking at a far-right theocratic state in the making here. Israel already had too many disturbing laws, and this will only make it worse.
With that being said, you're right, they might not try to eradicate the palestinian people, but they sure will try to make their lives hell under the current government. And by state policy, since they don't represent "the jewish character" of the state, they surely won't have a nice life there either.
They live in the past and don't understand that Israel became a state not worth supporting. Genocidal criminals that got their 9/11 after torturing Palestinians for long enough.
They will do to every non-jew what the US did to the Middle East.
Isreals security is Germany's obligation - fair enough.
What is Germany's obligation to the people of Palestine?
It doesn't exist.
one would think that murdering 50 million people of which 6 million were jews would lead to a more general responsibility to protect human lifes and international rule of law.
Well, personal political opinion as a German, is that it does and that we should obviously be opposed to the killing of any innocent person, but
there's multiple conflicts going on on this planet. We won't be able to solve all of them.
we also have an obligation to use our military defensively, not build up a massive army that can start WW3.
not everyone here holds the same opinion. This may come as a surprise, but there's nazis in Germany. Nazis that pay taxes and vote in our democracy.
There's also people who are younger than 80 years old. They may understand this obligation on a theoretical level, but when push comes to shove, they cannot possibly feel a personal obligation.
thereβs multiple conflicts going on on this planet. We wonβt be able to solve all of them.
But in those where we are involved we should take care of human life without being partisan. And most certainly not send weapons to actors comitting war crimes. This of course is not limited to Israel. Germany kept sending weapons to Saudi Arabia to commit terrible atrocities in Jemen. Heck Germany exported chemical plants and chemicals for the production of nerve gas to Saddam Hussein, whcih he subsequently used to murder Kurdish people in what remains the most devastating use of nerve gas since WW1.
And not blindly support a criminal state like Israel.
The average German is really unable to critize jews or Israel. They just follow blindly because that's how you get in less trouble.
It's sad, state media here is 95% pro Israel and 5% articles that acknowledge the humanitarian crisis, but never seem to grasp that it's Israel that is throwing 18000 bombs into an apartheid Ghetto.