this post was submitted on 06 Nov 2024
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Europe must take responsibility for its security, Polish FM says after Trump's win (kyivindependent.com)
submitted 13 hours ago by LaFinlandia@sopuli.xyz to c/ukraine@sopuli.xyz
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[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 91 points 13 hours ago (4 children)

He's right. The US can't be relied on for the next four years, at minimum. Hell, parts of the apparatus might be turned against European security.

Please, look after yourselves.

[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world 13 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (2 children)

It's not just about the next 4 years, we can't base our defense on a country we can only rely on for 4 years at a time.
There were already problems with Bush Jr. then Trump once, and now Trump again.
You'd have to be insane to believe this is just a one or two off, and things will get back to normal.
Normalcy regarding NATO ended already with Bush.

The times where USA was the deciding factor in most world policies, because USA was backed up by the majority of the global economy is over.
USA loses just as much as Europe and many other US allies. Trump said our so called friends are our true enemies. Trump believes Canada, UK, EU etc are enemies, and he has said directly that Russia and China are "not so bad". Despite Russia is invading in Europe, and threatening nuclear war, and China is behaving ever more aggressively in the China sea and against Taiwan, and in general against their neighbors.

[–] DrGeraintLLannfrancheta@nafo.army 1 points 9 hours ago (1 children)
[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world 2 points 9 hours ago

I don't think NATO is dead, but NATO allies can't rely on USA, and USA was by far the biggest military force in NATO.
Everything else was mostly built to support American forces, which in case of an article 5 situation is the commander of the NATO forces.

[–] Ismay@programming.dev 23 points 13 hours ago

Hasn't been in the last 8 years. At least.

The world can't keep building around a strong USA.

[–] SARGE@startrek.website 10 points 12 hours ago

US can’t be relied on for the next four years, at minimum.

Probably Optimistic :(

I don't think the US has been reliable since 2016 at the latest. And honestly after this... I don't think it ever will be again.

[–] AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world 26 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

And what Trump is likely to destroy in the coming years will take ages to rebuild, assuming it ever is.

We all hope it will be enough to shock the European governments into cooperating for once, but the odds are really stacked against that, even if some are willing.