Military aid, political aid, media campaigns, and so on. NED is literally an arm of US government engaged in regime change operations around the globe.

[–] pingveno@lemmy.ml -3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Ah yes the billions poured into Taiwan by NED. Now let's see, that's $461,785 in grants that include Taiwan somehow, then divide it by the population of Taiwan to get two pennies per person. I bet that's really going to move public opinion.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

US has been propping up separatists and shaping opinion in Taiwan since the end of WW2. There certainly have been billions poured into this project over the past 70s years. The fact that you can't even bring yourself to acknowledge this simple fact makes any meaningful discussion on the topic impossible.

Why do you think US is spending all that effort on an island half way across the world from it. Do you seriously believe it's because US regime cares about wellbeing of the people there when it doesn't even give a shit about its own populace?

[–] pingveno@lemmy.ml -5 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

I still trust the people of Taiwan to think for themselves more than I trust the CPC and Xi to tell them what's best for them at gunpoint.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Living in US, one would think you'd be well aware of how easily people can be manipulated. Your MAGA movement accounts for roughly 30% of the population now, is that just people thinking for themselves in your opinion? Would you support MAGA movements trying to secede from your country or would you claim that your government should intervene in that scenario?

[–] pingveno@lemmy.ml -4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's simply not a comparable scenario. MAGA folks are more numerous in certain areas, sure, but there isn't a MAGA government or region made entirely out of MAGA citizens. Comparing a political movement, even one the size of MAGA, with a sovereign government that has ruled over its now 23 million citizens for 70 years is a bad comparison.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

MAGA movement certainly has these characteristics in a few states like Texas and Florida. In fact, Texas actually made noises about exiting the union after the last election. This sentiment is likely to keep growing in the coming years. Again, let's say a foreign government like China or Russia started pouring money into this movement, arming it, openly helping MAGA politicians get into office, and so on. You would consider this to be just American people thinking for themselves?

You're also making a false statement about the government in Taiwan. KMT has been the government in Taiwan for most of its history, and it was actually moving towards reunification in 2014. US ran a color revolution to prevent that. Were you not aware of this fact or were you intentionally misrepresenting the situation?

[–] PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Again, let’s say a foreign government like China or Russia started pouring money into this movement,

Large numbers of people in US already seems to think it is: Dems say reps take money from Russia, and reps say dems take money from China. One could wonder how such banana republic is still keeping the world hegemony.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago

Right, and I think this is a direct result of the whole American exceptionalism idea. Most people in US have been convinced that their system is perfect, and it's the best system possible. So, when the system starts failing it must be because of sabotage by external actors as opposed to inherent flaws in the system itself. Democrats blame the Russians and say that republicans are their puppets, while republicans blame the Chinese and say the same about democrats.

In the end, nobody is focusing on the actual problems US is facing and as the material conditions continue to deteriorate the animosity and recriminations escalate. This polarization and tribalism is now creating conditions ripe for a civil war or a violent civil unrest. January 6 riot was the first example of that, but it most certainly won't be the last.

Meanwhile, US hegemony is rapidly unravelling on the world stage where the cost of the empire is becoming too much of a burden now. Countries are increasingly finding ways to stand up to US system of oppression, and the economic war with Russia has greatly accelerated this process.