this post was submitted on 10 Aug 2024
58 points (79.6% liked)
Asklemmy
43889 readers
777 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy ๐
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- !lemmy411@lemmy.ca: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Apply the color spectrum into the mix.
The color red is currently used by both "extreme" political groups in the U.S., the "extreme" leftists and the extreme conservatives. It's red for leftists because of communism and it's red for conservatives because of the republican party. The color has now also been co-opted by the far right and has made a comeback in the same spirit of the rise of fascism, so it's even more charged.
Does this factor into how you dress on a daily basis? Maybe, maybe not depending on the context.
Am I dressing up as a character with a lot of red? Unless they're political, it's probably not a statement. Is the outfit predominantly red with patches indicating a political spectrum? Then well, it's probably with that statement in mind. Are you in an area where the color red is affiliated with local gangs? Then you might avoid the color red entirely to prevent any accidents.
With that in mind, I still feel like weird is quite contextual. Sometimes things are weird because they are unusual. Sometimes unusual is mystical, sometimes unusual is haunting.
That's the thing about language, English somewhat moreso than others because of its nature. Words mean things based on the words surrounding them, and the meaning of a word on its own is ethereal and faceted until it has been placed in permanence within its sentence. This does not apply to all words of course, as there are obvious examples of words that are originated intentionally to be harmful, then ones that have been turned into colloquially harmful (equally harmful of course). The current case of weird is definitely the latter due to its etymology, and looking at what I've seen in social spaces... is the fear that weird will become a slur because it's being used against a person in politics, and trickle down into social insult? Because weird has always been a good and bad connotation of word. You have 2 kinds of weird uncles, you have 2 kinds of weird situations, you have 2 kinds of so many weird things because weird is weird. Sometimes it's slimy. Sometimes it's something beautiful, but unearthly. It is inherently a word far removed from the realm of concrete definition because, true to it's etymology, it comes from wyrd which meant fate. This seems important as fate itself is not set in permanence until the events occur. Something is weird because you aren't sure what to expect from it until it settles.
To me, this isn't inherently a bad thing. It is inherently a contextual thing though. If someone comes up to me and describes themselves as weird, that isn't very weird. It's forthcoming about someones personality, that they may be unusual. If we then pass by someone screaming at their phone over a donut they dropped because they hated their wife (idk) and I described him as "extremely weird", I don't think anyone except the angry man would feel insulted, nor should they, because my comment was towards the person and the circumstances.
Similarly weirdo can be a term of endearment or more derogatory, it's all just based on context. It's good to broaden our vocabulary though, so definitely don't let me stop you from shifting from using other words to describe the bizarre and vagary!
Also, this isn't to say that weird couldn't become a word we shouldn't say. If one day "the weirds" start getting targeted and people being genuinely afflicted in their livelihood then, well, yeah we're going to rethink the wording. I just am not sure that a few news outlets calling a sham politician and the last few days gestating that in the socialscape of the internet is really something we should be worrying about yet. Until then, weird will still be used by children to insult other children, it will be self ascribed by weird children and lauded by other children, and it will be used to describe unusual events both before and after they happen.
Weird is a great word for many circumstances. Do not let one circumstance define it, this one especially, not until it is so damning that it really should be brought to pasture.
My comment is all context. The word is not the problem, it's the way it's being used.
Try it in terms of double standards. It's an experiment that has been done. People see a man talking aggressively to a woman and some will intervene. People see a woman talking aggressively to a man and the number that intervenes drops significantly, some will cheer.
Or try it in terms of victims of violence. They see people fighting and they react as if they are in immediate danger. They feel safe with their friends, but their friends suddenly decide to start arguments on the street.
Reading what you wrote, I know you can understand the issue. We are not saying you all are wrong, just that it hurts. Can you understand why it hurts? That's the only thing that really matters and that I want to discuss right now.
I guess it's that weird has always been used to try to hurt us, it never stopped being used against the nerds and unusual kids. So a lot of my surprise is coming from the perspective of this is something new that's just now happening. To me, nothing has changed other than the word getting a temporary spotlight. Weird is still in the exact same space it was just a week ago, used as a reclaimed word for self expression and used as a derogatory word for those who are self expressing. How it's used derogatorily has always been nuanced, since there's the stereotype of the weird uncle (creepy) and the stereotype of the weird kid (unusual - ranging from school shooter to that kid with a really impeccable sense of fashion)
As people have used the word weird to describe themselves, maybe weird as an insult to us has gone down, but I'm just not sure why now it's any different that it's gotten use in general public as an insult.In my area, weird has been used to insult people for multiple decades. It's also been used by us as a general description of our weird group in the last few years. Neither of these meanings are related, or even come tangentially close.
Definitely not trying to dismiss people's feelings, I'm just not sure it needs to be as inflicting as it might feel. When it's used against conservatives it has less than nothing to do with you or I being weird, just like when it's used towards a weird uncle it has nothing to do with yours or my own weirdness, just like when we call ourselves weird it has nothing to do with weird uncles or weird conservatives. It covers a wide range and the reaction to socially ban the word seems unnecessary until there's a consequence.
Like, by all means be offended if someone calls you weird. I just think the reception from that will be quite varied, since some see weird as a positive self descriptor, this event completely unaffecting that notion, and some like we've seen share the sentiment you're highlighting. But balking at its usage would be equivalent to balking at being called haughty or any other regular adjective.
That is to say, being upfront to the person about their specific behavior may or may not be taken rudely based on how they feel about being confronted. If someone calls me weird, unless I am being inappropriate I shouldn't think anything of it. If I call someone weird, they shouldn't think anything of it unless they are being inappropriate. Other than that, it's entirely a matter of how comfortable I am being commented on and the context surrounding its usage.
And sometimes, it's simply "different". Weird can really just come down to something being unexpected. People think it's weird that I'm left handed, because it surprises them when they see it and it is uncommon.
The whole event of "weird" in public use the last week has been a variation of that. It is uncommon for a politician to have a scandal, true or not, about intimate relations with an inanimate object, and both in relation to and unrelated to the actions of you or I, that is honestly... Quite weird. Certainly, there could be other adjectives to use too, likely even better ones, but there is a certain emanence of normality being abnormalized which is why some feel the usage of it works so well. Specifically, it's being used against of people so deadset on being normal, which is why it's so effective because to them being weird is abnormal.
To the rest of us, normal is weird.
Remember when normie was used in the public sphere? Or NPC. Both of these were meant to bolster being weird and alienating being normal, because being weird was something to be prideful of. Now, why that was being expressed in a way to dismiss others normalness while bolstering ones own weirdness, I don't know.
So again, this isn't meaning to belittle or dismiss the way in which you interpret the word, pre- or post- these recent events and the usage of it after. Rather, an exploration that weird has always been used this way and never stopped, it was only further expanded upon by people who identified with a meaning of it. The way in which I've seen it used recently hasn't really been so much of a "how" it has been used, because there is no how, it has just been in sheer abundance. People are using it for calling out anything unusual from these politicians, which is different, fitting, and still unrelated to our purposes when we utilize weirdness. That is to say, every instance of seen it used has been a decree of "why did that person do this in this manner". And for the party that is dead set on normalcy, using weird as a way to point out specific behavior is a very strong method to show the hypocrisy.
Also for what it's worth, I'm fairly indifferent on the matter. I'm just a linguist with an interest in people's perception of colloquialisms, some feel one way, some feel another, and language makes way for both to exist simultaneously. While I personally don't think we should sunset a word immediately, because of this at least, as I said before it's not outside the realm of possibility. If society says that weird becomes a slur because we used it against conservatives and the meaning slipped so far from current meaning, then by all means we will reflect that in our day to day vocabulary. I would just be very surprised if that did happen from current circumstances.