My personal favorite is the "companies are obligated to support it forever, or open source the server software hosted by a third party, hosting paid for up front for at least a year."

They get to keep my money forever don't they?

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 42 points 9 months ago (4 children)

While I love the spirit of this idea, it gets complicated fast. Worlds adrift is a great example. The game’s server was created using some closed source libraries with a paid license. So when the owning company (Bossa Studios?) went under, they were unable to open source it.

A law like this would effectively kill all licensed software that isn’t a full product. I do agree though; we need a solution

[–] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 17 points 9 months ago (1 children)

When the initially licensed the library, they should’ve included distributed binary copies. That may have allowed them to release the source for their game alongside the binary of the library.

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 6 points 9 months ago (2 children)

An interesting idea but it’s not possible with all languages. E.g. golang. But probably not the case with worlds adrift. I’m guessing it’s more of an incentive problem for the other company. No more revenue = why bother?

[–] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 7 points 9 months ago

I think it’s like when a tv show doesn’t bother to negotiate the music rights for syndication and then they can’t air it anymore if the audio can’t be removed.

“What happens in 10 years?” Isn’t always a priority. Also, I’m sure that makes the price go up.

[–] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 3 points 9 months ago

Also, you could use CGo, but if you know golang, then you know why that’s not always a viable option.

[–] pimento64@sopuli.xyz 13 points 9 months ago (1 children)

A law like this would effectively kill all licensed software that isn’t a full product

What I'm hearing is: this law needs to be a constitutional amendment.

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 12 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Hmm I may be confused. Do you believe that software companies shouldn’t be allowed to build and sell libraries? I.e. They should only be allowed to sell full products, ready for an end user?

[–] Pika@sh.itjust.works 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Not the person you're responding to but I definitely think that Library should be able to be made, however I don't believe that they should be able to prevent a project from going open source in the case of company using the library going under, or if they wanted to keep it closed Source they should have to do something similar to what class action lawsuits do where anyone that is affected by it and opts into the agreement get some sort of compensation. Because it really is like a rug pull you buy a product and then the company makes the product unusable

[–] Maalus@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago

Except that isn't how it works, and could lead people to buy a library for a day, then opensource it.

Open source means any code used is widely available to anyone. Having a library you pay for means it cannot be widely available, or nobody would buy it. No more licensing game engines, paid libraries cease to exist since there is no incentive to make them, everything goes the "open source way" which means hard to use, opinionated, unintuitive software that is maintained by random people who rarely know what they are doing. No online banking, since you can't certify that easily and it wouldn't be profitable. No card with points and goodies in your supermarket for the exact same reason (points have a calculable value in real money). No online healthcare, etc etc

[–] pimento64@sopuli.xyz 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Yes.

I am aware that this would kill SaaS overnight, that's an intended feature.

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Fair enough regarding sass, though I disagree with the opinion.

But I’m asking about builders of partial software. For example, consider a single developer that builds a really great library for handling tables. It displays a grid, displays text in cells, maybe performs some operations between cells, etc. On its own, this software is useless but is very useful for other people to build other products. Should it be illegal to sell this software?

[–] eluvatar@programming.dev 1 points 9 months ago

I agree with you.

Though I would say that the grid software on its own IS useful. It's useful to developers, otherwise they wouldn't use it. Saying it's useless is like saying a hammer is useless because it's not a house, it's only good for building a house (among other things).

[–] ChicoSuave@lemmy.world 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

IIRC Bossa tried to open source it but they used a license for Spatial OS, which provided the backbone of their game. They were unable to make a stable game without it and opted to not open source it. But they were also in an early access that would probably provide an exception for a game closing down.

Bossa did leave the island creator active and has spun up Lost Skies on the same engine, which wouldn't be possible if they open sourced WA.

Ultimately the issue should be GaaS and MMOs are offerings service while other games are goods which have an artificial expiry date. This is a good test of software judication.

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

The subscription model makes plenty of sense. But there are loads of games that rely on server side components. That includes basically every multiplayer game that isn’t peer-to-peer. Any very many of them aren’t on a subscription.

I would love to require all that to be open source. But I still don’t see how to do it practically.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I'm fine with that, wanna keep it out of public hands, nut up and sell your stuff

[–] Lodra@programming.dev 3 points 9 months ago

Still difficult in that example. Bossa can’t force the other company to do anything.