this post was submitted on 12 Aug 2023
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This is a genuine question, as every time I have an argument about this with someone they bring a point so utterly stupid that it leaves me stumped...

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[–] jet@hackertalks.com 32 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If you care about the people you're talking to, belittling their entire viewpoint dismissively without countering their arguments. Is not going to win them over. In fact it might hurt their relationship with you.

If you have the time and inclination, take the argument they have that you have an issue with, and break it down to its fundamental points. It's a good exercise for both of you. Work through what things mean at a fundamental level to both of you and find what the core disagreement is. Is it philosophical, is it structural, is it traditional, there's many facets of an argument that people can latch on to. Having them explain why to you and then why the why etc can be helpful for both you and them to come to if not a common understanding but a mutual respect for positions.

But this is time intensive, and if we're just talking about randos on the internet it's not worth your time.

[–] Presi300@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago (2 children)

There is no disagreement, I just feel kinda sad seeing people that I've known for years fall into being red pill bots and try to act "cool" (like morons) any time anyone disagrees with them or dares say anything negative about that one rich asshole...

[–] jet@hackertalks.com 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Okay you've known them for years. That's a large time investment.

So when they do something you disagree with at a fundamental level, ask them to explain oh why do you support that? And then when they give you a high level answer ask them why that is there answer. Like peel the onion to get to their core issues. And if people's core issues that's just what other people say and they haven't thought about it, you're going to help them think about it for themselves. Which may not convert them but will at least get them to apply some intellectual rigor to their thinking

[–] blackbelt352@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Ahh the Socratic Method. One of the most effective means of teaching is playung just dumb enough, asking the right questions and getting them to provide some evidence. Make them convince you of their point of view and just keep pointing out the flaws once they start making contradictions.

[–] adeoxymus@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

What do you tell them right now? Do you ague or tell them they’re idiots?

[–] Presi300@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Mostly the ladder, as I've exhausted my strength to argue with them