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Important: never execute code or follow advice that you don't understand or can't verify, especially here. The word of the day is credibility. This is a meme community -- even the most helpful comments might just be shitposts that can damage your system. Be aware, be smart, don't fork-bomb your computer.
Ubuntu is ok. That's it. Let them get on with their life. An OS is a tool that shouldn't get in the way of the user of trying to achieve a goal. If Ubuntu works for them, Ubuntu is good. Linux has to be a solution, a way to a goal not the actual goal.
Yall wonder why the desktop Linux community hasn’t grown as much as you wish and then upvote stuff like this
The constant superiority struggles do nothing but alienate most computer users
I'm not sure that's why.
My two cents: I got really annoyed with windows after a random update pushing stuff I don't want or need, so I spun up Ubuntu. I've used a lot in the past, but stopped using it because of anti-cheat in some games, got tired of switching whenever I wanted to play.
Coming back, I find out about snaps. Not a good start, but I found instructions to revert to the good old apt packages I wanted. But then I spent way too long trying to coax the taskbar/system/clock to appear where I wanted them to, plus having things working well in my multi monitor setup, and at some point I just went back to Windows.
I couldn't care less about distro squabbles, but I do care greatly about usability and polish, and it seems like we're taking steps back here.
i’m with you.
there are absolutely multiple things leading to an alienation of users and distro squabbles is just one, which i agree is insignificant.
the real thing posts like this betray is the deeper pattern of disdain and coldness even toward those on the “in group.” there is virtually no sense of camaraderie or mutual respect in the community. rtfm culture and one-up-manship are something of the default here, with user experience, accessibility, and user facing documentation falling deeply into the wayside.
Distro wars are silly. If someone is happy using Ubuntu, I'm happy they're a linux user.
Except the specific distro you use impacts your choices and the future direction and success of Linux as a whole.
If you pick the single enshittified distro then you serve to perpetuate it's influence.
This silly infighting serves to perpetuate people staying on windows or mac os
it doesn't though.
people continue to use Windows because it's already installed.
people continue to use Ubuntu because they have brain damage and forget that Ubuntu sells your telemetry to 3rd party vendors and that Canonical is the flip-side of the Microsoft coin.
Why not use a free distro like Debian, or Arch, or Mint?
Mint especially wouldn't take much to get used to for an Ubuntu user.
people continue to use Ubuntu because they have brain damage
See, this is the type of uselessly disparaging dialogue that people take issue with. Why on earth did you think that this is an OK thing to say?
You don't think some people who consider trying linux make a web search or ask a question somewhere only to get turned off by people immediately arguing about distros and calling them brain damaged?
Right now it's ubuntu that's the meme target, but there's always something like this. If everyone stopped using ubuntu tomorrow, the people who somehow get their self esteem from having a better distro will find something else to fuel that. They will never be happy
I'm happy if people use linux. I'm even happy if they use WSL or homebrew rather than plain windows or os x as it's a gateway drug, even though having windows in particular as a base system seems needlessly painful
Same as the Unix wars and Vim vs. Emacs.
Here to represent the Arch Linux master race!
lolsteamos
There's no need to snap
Femcel: I will flatten you if you disagree with me <3
Don't snap at me, but it would be more apt of you to make a flat pack, or create an app image, or you might get stuck in a tar ball.
Snaps make sens from the Ubuntu side.
Only one package to maintain for an application, even if they have different distributions to maintain. If snap is officially supported by the creator of the application, then it's less work for Canonical. Well, it would have make more sens if flatpak didn't exist.
From user side, it makes way less sens :
I'd say snaps are aimed at servers. A big aspect of both Flatpaks and Snaps is the whole sandboxed environment thing.
I think that's a major reason Canonical flubbed snaps, is they shoved them down the throats of casual users instead of focusing on using them in server situations where you want things more "locked down."
Once again, it does seem silly that they reinvented the wheel, but I mean, that's actually really common. So common there is an XKCD comic about it. So due to how commonplace such a thing is, it seems weird to attack Canonical so much over it.
it seems weird to attack Canonical so much over it.
I mean, on the technical side, sure. Canonical's technical choice is just weird. Plenty of fully open app store environments have almost no competition, because self hosting is still hard work.
But all of the business reasons - for having a closed proprietary sole app server - go against everything that Canonical used to claim they stood for.
Canonical's business choice not to open source the snap servers is an open declaration of war against the FOSS community who have previously rallied around them.
It's like inviting someone into my basement and locking the door with a key as they get to the bottom step. The action isn't illegal, but the probable motive is creepy as fuck. (Maybe I just watch too many horror movies. Lol.)
Nobody gave a fuck when Launchpad was open sourced. People just demand and demand and when a company does the thing they don't care.
Yeah, I mean. If I unlock the basement door, I don't suddenly regain all the trust I lost, either.
What happened to Ubuntu?
It's popular and widely used so people naturally hate it.
forcing snaps on people (if you apt-get firefox it'll install the snap even though you didn't install it with snap), adding ads for it, snap having a proprietary backend, snap being essentially just a fundamentally worse version of flatpak.
the only advantage i've heard for snap is that it's easier to package for.
Plus I think if you want the advantages of a stable release, easy for user, distro, they'll also need to be immutable now, what's the usecase for a non-immutable, stable, easy to use distro?
If you didn't care about ease of use, you wouldn't want immutable, but if you do, you absolutely do.
If you don't care about stability, you might not care about immutable, but if you do, you absolutely do.
Ubuntu seems like a prime usecase for an immutable distro, but it isn't for tradition-related reasons rather than it actually being good for users.
Snap is also useful for server software and it can apparently be used for more low level things such as drivers. Still, it being properiatary is enough for me to avoid it completely.
I use Kubuntu LTS. Went with --minimal-install. No snap to worry about from the get-go.
I still use Ubuntu server. It’s not nearly as atrocious as Ubuntu desktop.
Ubuntu Server LTS releases are unbelievably good. They are absolutely solid as a rock. I've had several VMs running it for almost a decade with zero issues.
Ubuntu desktop doesn't suit my use case though,and nor does Gnome.