Thank you for making it toggleable per community and per user. This sort of bot might be fun for some people, but outright annoying for others. And I feel like this creates a good precedent, as other bot makers will see yours and say "hey, I should make mine toggleable too".
this post was submitted on 17 Jun 2023
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It can be toggled by anyone but the toggle would affect the whole community atm, I'm not able to make its messages visible only so some users yet, although it would be very very nice! perhaps blocking the bot account can be a way to hide all its posts? I'll think about this!
It's fine if it's visible to the whole community; my issue is when bots come uninvited by anyone, or interact with content of someone who didn't invite it, as in Reddit. I feel like yours is already leagues better than Reddit ones in this regard.
Plus if someone subscribe to a really annoying bot, to the point that annoys other users, other users will eventually ask to the first one "dude, please unsubscribe to this bot, you're adding noise".
My fear is that some users want this bot, other does not, and so it will be added and removed 16 times/day by different users... if this happens I'll reserve the mods the ability to add and remove it to their communities, but I hope that this won't be necessary
Here’s a human haiku:
bots are part of what
made reddit such a wasteland.
most bots are just spam.
i wish lemmy would
remain a place for humans.
why can’t we just talk?
I absolutely agree, that's why I made it togglable by anyone who likes
If you agree that most bots are spam, then why are you making and promoting bots?
because most bots are spam doesn't mean that all bots are spam. unrequested invasive bots are definitely spam, but bots that can be enabled or disabled freely do nothing wrong IMO
Okay - What value does a haiku bot add?
It only tells you that a post was 17 syllables...
- and then duplicates a comment (spam),
- and then stretches the duplicated comment vertically (spam).
so you are able to not subscribe to it or even block it if you want
You did not answer the question... I asked you:
How is a haiku bot not invasive spam?
It's basically the same as the "all numbers in your post add up to 69" bot.
some people enjoys it, some people doesn't. from wikipedia:
Spamming is the use of messaging systems to send multiple unsolicited messages (spam) to large numbers of recipients for the purpose of commercial advertising, for the purpose of non-commercial proselytizing, for any prohibited purpose (especially the fraudulent purpose of phishing), or simply repeatedly sending the same message to the same user.
the keyword is unsolicited: you don't want it? just don't add it to your communities. you want it? add it to your community. it doesn't bother you at all if it's unsolicited.
I'm asking you - what value do YOU think this Haiku bot adds?
I think a haiku bot is funny, especially in the right circumstances. It was one of the only bots I enjoyed seeing around reddit.
The issue with bots in Reddit was less about their existence, and more about how unsolicited, forced, and pushy they were, since the administration of that site never imposed some limits on what a bot could/couldn't do. But at the end of the day they're just a tool, and need to be treated as such - prevent abuse, don't just kill the tech.
This is easy to prove by looking at the extremes:
- Roboragi - only triggered by request, subreddit-specific, providing contextual information relevant to the discussion
- CommonMisspellingBot - triggered by accident, regardless of subreddit, bossing you around with off-topic prescription
It's clear why one was loved, another hated. And yet both are bots.
And OP is simply testing the viability of the tech here, based on what he says.
1 - Yes - some bots are helpful, some (most) are annoying:
-
a Haiku bot falls into your "triggered by accident" category (any post that is 17 syllables).
-
a Haiku bot also does not add any new contextual information (it just duplicates a comment).
That's why I'm saying the haiku bot is junk.
2 - In this very post, when Otome said "I never liked the Haiku Bot"... OP responded "I’ve never liked them much either"...
so I'm asking OP: "why create a bot to spam lemmy with low-value duplicate content, if you don't even like that bot yourself?"
a Haiku bot falls into your “triggered by accident” category (any post that is 17 syllables).
Only if opt-out, as the original Haiku bot in the defunct site. OP however made it opt-in, so in order to trigger it you need two conditions - to actively subscribe to the bot and post a 17-syllables comment. The first one won't happen on accident.
a Haiku bot also does not add any new contextual information (it just duplicates a comment).
Arguably it highlights that the post has 17 syllables in a shape that is suitable to build a haiku with, but in general I agree with you. It is not the kind of bot that I personally would inscribe in my comms, nor that I'd use myself.
Even then, a few people like this sort of gimmick, so there's some subjective value for some people. (Certainly not for both of us.)
so I’m asking OP: “why create a bot to spam lemmy with low-value duplicate content, if you don’t even like that bot yourself?”
OP himself answered it - "I wanted to try something easy to learn bot development on lemmy and a few users were waiting for this and so here I am!"
It's a low-hanging fruit, and a few people wanted it.
EDIT: just to make my position clear, I think that a few restrictions on what a bot can/can't do would be great, specially if they come from the admins. IMHO a good bot should have the following requirements:
- Must be explicitly tagged as a bot, instead of a human being.
- Must perform a specific, well-defined function.
- Must only act once explicitly allowed by either the user or the moderators of a community, through a standard approach.
- Must have a short, succinct output, that doesn't force other users to scroll past a lot of junk.
- Should be non-prescriptive in nature; it shouldn't be telling you what to do.
Again, I wouldn't use this bot, but I think that it already fits all five requirements.
“OP made it opt-in”
1 - It’s not opt-in "By User" though. It’s opt-in "By Community"...
So if one person turns it on, 1000’s of other people see it.
OP keeps saying “you can just toggle it off”... but I really can’t... when anyone can toggle it back on.
2 - Future options for toggling are not much better (bottom of the repo, To-Do section):
-
"if a moderator adds the haiku-bot, non-mod users cannot remove it"
-
“only allow moderators to subscribe/unsubscribe”
...so the toggle option wouldn’t apply to 99% of people anyway.
“a few users were waiting for this (-OP)”
Who was waiting for it? The top level replies in this thread are:
- you, who wouldn’t use it
- me, who doesn’t want it
- Otome, who doesn’t like it
I think your bot rules are pretty solid though.
Overall, I just feel like... Lemmy is a fresh space...
a chance to make a new culture...
maybe it's best to leave that old bloated carcass behind.
Who was waiting for it?
I was :)
thanks for making it opt-in rather than opt-out or non-toggleable. I've never liked the haiku bot on reddit since it never made much sense to me. but it's nice to see development going on regardless. :)
fun fact, I've never liked them much neither XD but I wanted to try something easy to learn bot development on lemmy and a few users were waiting for this and so here I am!
Are you planning to create any more bots now that you have dipped your toes into bot development?
I surely will, compatibility with my free time!
I was thinking of making a community to discuss about lemmy bots development, with tutorials and requests