this post was submitted on 21 Nov 2023

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Palestinian Death Toll in Gaza Tops 13,000 as Israel Repeatedly Strikes U.N. Schools Housing Refugees (www.democracynow.org)

submitted 10 months ago by stopthatgirl7@kbin.social to c/worldnews@lemmy.ml

38 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Over the weekend, at least 82 Palestinians were killed in Israeli strikes on Jabaliya refugee camp, including multiple United Nations schools sheltering Palestinians. At least 85 incidents of Israeli bombing have impacted 67 facilities run by the United Nations relief agency for Palestine refugees (UNRWA) in the last two months. We speak with Tamara Alrifai, spokesperson for UNRWA, about the organization sheltering close to a million Palestinians from Israel’s assault, which has killed 104 of her colleagues since the beginning of the war — the highest number of United Nations aid workers killed in a conflict in the history of the United Nations. Alrifai says her agency is only getting half of the fuel they need to serve people in Gaza, being forced to choose between clean water, food and transport. “If UNRWA ceases to exist tomorrow, then there is a huge layer of stabilizing and stability that UNRWA usually offers in a very, very volatile area that also collapses.”

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[–] irreticent@lemmy.world 22 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Disgusting. This "war" needs to end.

[–] netchami@sh.itjust.works 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Disgusting. Israel ~~This "war"~~ needs to end this genocide.

[–] bartolomeo@suppo.fi 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

And occupation.

[–] netchami@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago

Absolutely true

[–] Annoyed_Crabby@monyet.cc 20 points 10 months ago (2 children)

A reminder that the number one priority of this "war" for Israrl is to eliminate Hamas(while laying waste to Gaza, making it inhabitable), while the hostage is second. The longer they drag the likelier the hostages is gonna end up dead, and Netanyahu is complicit on their death.

[–] OurTragicUniverse@kbin.social 45 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Like fuck. The number one goal of this genocide is to eradicate Palestinians.

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -39 points 10 months ago (5 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] OurTragicUniverse@kbin.social 32 points 10 months ago

Fuck off zionist

[–] OmenAtom@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago

This fits the definition of both apartheid and genocide

[–] HuddaBudda@kbin.social 13 points 10 months ago (1 children)

unlike what you see here..
what you see here is propaganda.

Propaganda for better solutions that don't involve bombing city blocks because one gang thug had an RPG outside a hospital.

Maybe I am not comfortable with Israel's aim

Maybe I am not comfortable with killing children and teenagers for the sins of a gang of thugs.

Maybe I am not comfortable with killing civilians if it is going to lead to a broader war.

Either way, what really irks me, is that everyone is okay with it. If this happened in any other place in the world, we would be clawing bloody murder, but because it happens in un-wealthy Gaza. I am a propagandist?

Guess it's okay to kill kids so long as they are poor and (possibly) Muslim? What kind of propaganda are you spewing?

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -18 points 10 months ago (2 children)

@HuddaBudda

@stopthatgirl7 @Annoyed_Crabby @OurTragicUniverse\

i will keep saying this until i am dead.... war is terrible. you don't like it? then don't get in one. when a group locates legitimate targets among civilians and human shields, THAT IS THE WAR CRIME HERE. you deal with that by attacking anyway and demonstrate to the enemy that tactic does not work and will not be tolerated. you want to get mad? then direct the anger where its deserved. at the group which purposely uses their own people as propaganda by using them as human shields and crying about civilian deaths.

the situation is beyond the point of tiptoeing around world opinion and rose-colored glasses wearing people like you. any org that employs the tactics hamas has used should be wiped out. period. i said the same thing about the taliban years ago and i'll say it again.
what you see is what happens in war. civilians die. don't like it? then do whatever you have to in order to avoid it.

[–] be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social 16 points 10 months ago (1 children)

you deal with that by attacking anyway and demonstrate to the enemy that tactic does not work and will not be tolerated.

And when that doesn't work you do it again
and again
and again
and again
and again
...

Because it's more important to demonstrate that you absolutely will kill innocents who have been put in harm's way in order to show Hamas (and the rest of the world) exactly what your version of justice looks like than it is to try something different.

And we're paying attention, I can promise you that.

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

@be_excellent_to_each_other
no. its a demonstration that the tactics of terrorists will not be a deterrent. what will paying ransoms to hostage takers get you? more hostages. what will not attacking targets with human shields get you? more human shields. you fucking people don't seem to realize you are justifying and enabling those actions. its not justice. its war. justice would be prosecuting the terrorists. terrorists ARE NOT SOLDIERS. hamas ARE NOT SOLDIERS. people need to get that through their collective heads.

@stopthatgirl7 @Annoyed_Crabby @OurTragicUniverse @HuddaBudda

[–] be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

what will not attacking targets with human shields get you? more human shields.

You know what attacking targets with "human shields" gets you? More dead innocent people. Try not to forget the "human" part of that word.

Edit: Gonna start adding this article to a lot of my replies on this topic. More people should read this and encourage this kind of future. When I figure out what sub it belongs in, I'll post it as a thread there.

https://lifeisasacredtext.substack.com/p/hand-in-hand

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -11 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

@be_excellent_to_each_other
tell that to the organization that is actively using the human shields. then tell the palestinians that it will all stop when they stand up to hamas.

and my edit.
by all means keep your link in mind, never forget it, and shout it at the top of your lungs any time you see a terrorist kill civilians, any time you see a rocket launcher in front of an apartment complex, any time you see a terrorist turn his weapon on a person who is not a uniformed soldier, or does that just apply to empathy for palestinians?

[–] reddwarf@feddit.nl 7 points 10 months ago

You really do not give 1 shit about children do you? You keep telling people that this is what you get if you start a war. Did the children start that war? No. Then why keep bombing them?

Even if Hitler himself hides under a hospital or school, you do not bomb that place. It really is that simple. The fact that you are a-ok with bombing children speaks volumes about your character.

Surprise me with insights on why you think it is ok to bomb children and please do not involve hamas, terrorists or some form of anti-antisemitism. Keep focused on bombs on the heads of 5 year old, babies and justify that without involving adults that these children have zero control over.

[–] be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social 3 points 10 months ago

OK thank you for your input, have a nice day!

[–] HuddaBudda@kbin.social 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

legitimate targets among civilians and human shields, THAT IS THE WAR CRIME HERE.

Like when Israel bombed a refugee camp to get a single Hamas Leader?

Oh, maybe you meant when Hamas targeted the preschools on Oct 7?

There are no saints in this war.

you deal with that by attacking anyway and demonstrate to the enemy that tactic does not work and will not be tolerated.

Hamas, seems to be doing fine, it's the people of Gaza that have to take the hits. Also not a warm idea for the hostages you've doomed to death.

the situation is beyond the point of tiptoeing around world opinion and rose-colored glasses wearing people like you.

Empathy, the word you are looking for is called Empathy.

any org that employs the tactics hamas has used should be wiped out.

Agreed, use better tactics, aim, and FFS stop hitting the children.

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -11 points 10 months ago (2 children)

@HuddaBudda
hmm. spoken by someone that shows zero understanding of the real world. "Like when Israel bombed a refugee camp to get a single Hamas Leader?"-----yes. exactly that.

"Oh, maybe you meant when Hamas targeted the preschools on Oct 7?"
"Empathy, the word you are looking for is called Empathy"

do you have empathy for those killed on oct 7? do you have empathy for those crammed in shelters due to indiscriminate or blatant attacks on civilians by hamas? while their rockets may not be precision accurate, the ballistic characteristics alone offer enough accuracy to avoid them dropping in the middle of population centers in israel. do you have empathy for that?

empathy goes out the window after what happened oct 7. i watched the twin towers fall on 9/11 in new york. there was no talk of empathy. from anyone. but i heard a few comments about the world needing a reminder of what a nuke can do.

we are beyond empathy here. eliminating hamas and their underground infrastructure requires the tactics israel is using. THAT IS WAR. you want to talk empathy? have at it. civilians always lose in war. but don't talk like israel is the unholy offender here. hamas deserves what they are getting and palestinians need to oust hamas themselves to get my empathy. the video of them dancing in the streets the day after 9/11 tells me all i need to know about them.

@stopthatgirl7 @Annoyed_Crabby @OurTragicUniverse

[–] HuddaBudda@kbin.social 11 points 10 months ago

do you have empathy for those killed on oct 7? do you have empathy for those crammed in shelters due to indiscriminate or blatant attacks on civilians by hamas? while their rockets may not be precision accurate, the ballistic characteristics alone offer enough accuracy to avoid them dropping in the middle of population centers in israel. do you have empathy for that?

We call this multi-tasking, but yes. Generally one can feel empathy for more then one party, it isn't a zero sum game.

empathy goes out the window after what happened oct 7. i watched the twin towers fall on 9/11 in new york. there was no talk of empathy. from anyone. but i heard a few comments about the world needing a reminder of what a nuke can do.

It is a shame people only watched our rage, and didn't learn the lesson 10 trillion dollars later, and all our hard work evaporating in 3 days.

Hypocrite that I am, fool I am not. Learn from our mistakes or be doomed to repeat them.

we are beyond empathy here. eliminating hamas and their underground infrastructure requires the tactics israel is using.

I disagree, there are better methods, more informed methods, safer methods for sure, if we thought about this any other way beside treating bombs like magic pixie dust that makes problems disappear.

[–] xerazal@lemmy.zip 8 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Lol love hearing jackasses say "you don't understand the real world" when it's actually them that doesn't understand the real world and as an excuse to justify a genocide.

When the US took out Osama, it didn't do it with bombs. It was with special forces. Same is needed here.

[+] OBIWAN_SALAMI@kbin.social -10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

@xerazal
most of you don't. the real world isn't rainbows and unicorn color farts.
calls me a jackass and then proceeds to somehow confuse 1 man with an organisation. nice job. if this is the best you can come up with then you are NOT doing yourself any favors.
you show me 1 special ops org in the world that can eliminate hamas by itself. there isn't one. anywhere. that requires these things called "armies". which have well equipped soldiers with support units, lines of communication and resupply, things you bleeding heart armchair wannabe generals don't know about.

and btw, look up the definition of genocide, how the term has been used historically, and then understand why it doesn't apply here. because there is a difference in scale, motivation, and outcome. and i'll ask this of all those who spout this shit.....if its a genocide then why aren't israeli's invading west bank? and no, a few raids and strikes doesn't count.

which all says its a campaign against hamas. which has little power in west bank.

try again.

[–] be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

https://jewishcurrents.org/a-textbook-case-of-genocide

Ah I see you've already rejected this publication because it's too "bleeding heart" for you lol.

Well, I don't have an article from Fox News or OANN, but:

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2023-11-19/israel-hostages-gaza-bombing-civilians-genocide-holocaust-studies

https://time.com/6334409/is-whats-happening-gaza-genocide-experts/

https://theweek.com/politics/the-genocide-debate-in-gaza

The most ambiguous of those says maybe not yet, but it's evidence that we need to act before it becomes reality.

[–] yesman@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I just want to point out that amidst all the death and destruction, you're problem is how people are using a word. What can be more bad faith than ignoring the reality and fighting over the signifier?

Words are not reality; you cannot drive home in the word "car".

[–] c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

Words explain ideas, improper definitions lead to miscommunications. Words matter and changing definitions has always been a sign of an attempt to smuggle ideas in.

"Genocide" used to mean a concerted attempt to actively exterminate a group of people based on their race. Now it just means "anything that disrupts local culture." It's like watering down the word "murder" to mean "physical assault." It's not that assaulting people is ok, it's that it's not murder.

"Words don't matter" is some of the most smooth brain bullshit I've ever seen, as if our entire conceptualization of ideas isn't rooted in what words we use to define them.

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 3 points 10 months ago

Every dead hostage is another propaganda victory for Israel. While Hamas will truthfully say that the hostage died due to an airstrike, Israel can just blame Hamas for killing the hostage.

[–] ComradeWeebelo@lemm.ee 19 points 10 months ago (4 children)

Why is the IDF still relying on bombing and artillery strike to stop Hamas if it's proven it causes such high civilian casualties?

You're funded and supplied by the largest military industrial complex in the world and its allies and you're telling me you can't get troops on the ground to rescue hostages?

It almost seems intentional at this point and if they keep this up, between them blowing the shit out of Gaza and Hamas executing/torturing hostages, there won't be anyone left to rescue.

[–] Algaroth@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Ukraine has drones they use to take out specific targets. But for some reason Israel doesn't?

[–] GutsBerserk@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

IDF's objective is to inflict as much violence/barbarism/terror as they can so that 2.1 million people vacate their land. And it is precisely what they are doing. Hostages are not even a real objective at this point. Source: IDF commanders/ Israeli ministers/TV channels

[–] 4lan@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

They see every Palestinian baby as a terrorist. They have manufactured their justification for slaughtering children.

[–] NAXLAB@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

The main reason is because they already learned from the United States that going into combat in dense cities doesn't work when you're the one attacking. They care more about their own lives than the lives of innocent people.

[–] DmMacniel@feddit.de 12 points 10 months ago

This is fucking disheartening.

[–] bartolomeo@suppo.fi 11 points 10 months ago

Israel is occupying Gaza and controls Gaza's water supply, electricity, and borders. Gaza (and the West Bank) have Israeli cameras everywhere, using facial recognition software to create profiles for basically every single citizen. If you think Israel is going after Hamas but jUSt CaN'T fiNd TheM you're falling for the sleight of hand, and in this case especially, if you're not actively supporting the oppressed (at least by speaking out against injustice) then you're actively supporting the oppressor.

[–] OurTragicUniverse@kbin.social 7 points 10 months ago (2 children)

So ww3 is going to happen when?

[–] 0x2d@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

soon

[–] zerfuffle@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

I'm sure they were all Hamas.

Now they are all hummus.

[–] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 10 months ago

Fuck you, Israel.

As an aside, I'm reading an interesting book called The Origins of Satan. It was onscreen being read in an ep of Sopranos (Janice) and I looked up reviews and it sounded interesting. Very interesting historical context about judasim c. 1st century on early christianity. Fwiw, I'm an atheist. This is still one of the best books I've read this year. I'm learning a lot.

[–] little_hermit@lemmus.org 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

There are better ways to eliminate humus. Like banning it from the grocery stores. All this death and destruction over a condiment is INSANE.

[–] little_hermit@lemmus.org 1 points 10 months ago

Down voters don't understand how easy it is to make their own. Chickpeas, Sesame paste, Garlic, and Olive oil. No need to downvote banning of hummus. Losers!