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What do you think of antinatalism? (feddit.de)

submitted 1 year ago by sexy_peach@feddit.de to c/politics@beehaw.org

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antinatalism

I think it's stupid and worrying that their ideas are gaining traction.

I am not opposed to people not having children or representing themselves as a block, but the idea that having kids is bad is just plain dumb.

My own experience in life makes it reek a lot like mental health issues in those who are antinatalists.

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[–] dax@beehaw.org 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

My own experience in life makes it reek a lot like mental health issues in those who are antinatalists.

I mean, is that not a good enough reason not to have kids?

Assertions I'd like to make, in no specific order:

Yes, my retirement might not even happen because of falling birthrates.
We live in a world of finite resources and an imperfect method of distributing them.
It's only going to get worse, especially with climate change.
If we don't have a population contraction voluntarily now, eventually we're going to have one involuntarily later, as people turn to force.
Wars over constrained resources are an end in and of themselves. It doesn't even matter if you gain control of other resources; if you win, you get more resources to buy your people a little more time. If you lose, you got rid of a lot of people who need and want things.

These problems are all solvable. These problems are also not plausibly going to be solved, as those who have will do their level best to turn away from those who have not. We have literal centuries of evidence neatly showcasing just how selfish our systems are, and how resilient to change they are.

You can absolutely have as many kids as you want. I personally think it's myopic, as you're forcing someone else to deal with these problems and you didn't even give them an option - and by the time they're old enough to understand the magnitude of the problem, they're in too deep to get out. It just screams of selfishness and duplicity to me. But, I mean, I'm still friends with omnivores - hell, I'm one myself - being selfish and inconsistent is kinda fundamentally what humans are, so it's not like my shit doesn't stink too.

Edit: I should also note that the one reason I allow myself to eat animal products is because I've said "well, I'm not having kids, so I'm just a temporary problem, not an ongoing one"

[–] rayzor@beehaw.org 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

you’re forcing someone else to deal with these problems and you didn’t even give them an option - and by the time they’re old enough to understand the magnitude of the problem, they’re in too deep to get out. It just screams of selfishness and duplicity to me.

this narrative has always been touted that every generation inherits the problems of its ancestors. and yet the world continues to survive and improve. death rates have fallen, infant mortality has fallen, life expectancy has risen, happiness has risen in some countries, mobility across countries has increased for some (but not all or enough). There are problems but I am hoping 100 years from now we'll solve it and our children will have a better life. Maybe I am an optimist, but all I can use is my own anecdotal experience.

[–] dax@beehaw.org 4 points 1 year ago

oh, I'd say you are an optimist - and that doesn't mean you're wrong! I think the reason why this conversation is so contentious is that both sides are right; they just prioritize different things. I'm way more focused on the individuals you're deciding for, whereas you're more focused on the collective and the impact it would have.

I personally hold this opinion that nobody should have kids. Not for a couple decades. None! I also hold the opinion that nobody should ever eat cream cheese, because it's fucking gross.

I also think that everyone should be free to have kids or eat cream cheese if they decide it's right for them.

[–] sexy_peach@feddit.de 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I personally think it’s myopic, as you’re forcing someone else to deal with these problems and you didn’t even give them an option - and by the time they’re old enough to understand the magnitude of the problem, they’re in too deep to get out. It just screams of selfishness and duplicity to me.

This is the part I don't really understand. I am not grateful for existing either, but existing has got to be a neutral, right? Idk

[–] dax@beehaw.org 4 points 1 year ago

This is the part I don’t really understand. I am not grateful for existing either, but existing has got to be a neutral, right? Idk

I mean, maybe? The point is you never gave the kid a choice. They never had agency in this. Like, admittedly, it can't be any other way, but it shouldn't surprise you that some people don't feel comfortable deciding things of that magnitude for anyone else.

[–] sexy_peach@feddit.de 3 points 1 year ago

I allow myself to eat animal products

ha checkmate I'm vegan btw ;)