politics
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
view the rest of the comments
Each requires a different strategy. Someone who is fooled may lack critical thinking skills or exposure to people or ideas outside of their information bubble. These problems are rectifiable if approached with care.
The other is more difficult, and requires a deeper understanding of the underlying causes behind their opinions.
Using the wrong approach on the wrong person wastes time and resources, and also risks hardening their position.
Anyone who pretends to not know what Trump is about is just a liar. People who vote for him want fascism and that's why they vote for him. I'm sick and tired of the excuses.
No, a lot of people just don't pay any attention, unfortunately. If they get their news mainly through the grapevine or social media circles, they might very well have been taken by the con.
That's what they'll say but I'm not buying it.
I mean, you had history classes in HS, right? What percentage of the class engaged, paid attention and learned the material, vs what percentage just did whatever it took to pass the class, didn't really give a fuck, and then promptly forgot everything once they passed it?
We have to remember how our fellow Americans really are. Some pay attention, some just don't. The one's that don't probably couldn't even explain to you what fascism actually is, they'd probably say "I dunno, killing Jews?" or something.
I'm not American.
I don't really think most people form their beliefs based on what is logically true; they get their cues from the group who makes them feel a sense of community.
Deviation from this accepted morality carries the risk of being ostracized, and acts as a control mechanism to keep people in line.
The real issue, in my opinion, is that people are getting their moral cues from an amoral media who wants to enrage them for profit and then the reactionaries carry that back to their communities to feed it into their echo chambers.
Therefore, I don't really think facts will change people's politics; that will not happen until their reactionary community either is no longer useful to them or they find something more worthwhile outside of it. I respectfully reject that there is a fundamentally different strategy for "true believers" and "the fooled;" I'd say both populations are mostly the same (except for the politicians, who know exactly what the game is).
No, facts absolutely can change people's minds, from my anecdotal experience anyway. They simply have to be handled with a great deal of care, you can't speak down to people, you have to ask careful questions and respectfully approach even their false opinions.
Taking an almost Socratic method, in a way, where you're spending more time listening than hosing them down with evidence.
It's not easy, I wouldn't say most people can readily do it without training or at least carefully considering their strategic approach. It does not come naturally, and traditional schooling or debate will not prepare you for it, and can even be counterproductive. There is a real risk of doing more harm than good. But deprogramming is absolutely a feasible goal to work towards. Just takes patience.
I do think that those types of conversations are useful, but only to someone who is doxastically prepared to change due to the aforementioned community reasons.
I think we're mostly in agreement though and we're just using different terms, so thanks for sharing your perspective. If you're interested, I read a great book a while ago called How Minds Change that digs into it a bit more.
Yeah that's a valid point. Thanks for the link, I'm unfamiliar with that book.