this post was submitted on 13 Sep 2024
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politics

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"Progressives should not make the same mistake that Ernst Thälmann made in 1932. The leader of the German Communist Party, Thälmann saw mainstream liberals as his enemies, and so the center and left never joined forces against the Nazis. Thälmann famously said that 'some Nazi trees must not be allowed to overshadow a forest' of social democrats, whom he sneeringly called 'social fascists.'

After Adolf Hitler gained power in 1933, Thälmann was arrested. He was shot on Hitler’s orders in Buchenwald concentration camp in 1944."

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[–] LesserAbe@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago (22 children)

So people who don't live in swing states should vote third party until there's enough of them that the state is in danger of going to trump (or whoever)? If they're successful at some point that's a threat.

How do we actually get third party candidates to win, not just "oh, Ross Perot Jr got 3% of the vote"?

However you slice it, we're looking at like a 20 year struggle minimum to get election reform, and it would be at least the same length to elect a third party candidate to the office of president, but that's a one off thing. (Or more likely that third party would be the new one of two parties)

If we're committed to the struggle of improving things, we might as well improve a reusable process rather than have a single go at a third party presidential candidate.

[–] TrippyFocus@lemmy.ml -1 points 3 weeks ago (21 children)

If enough people are voting third party that it’s a threat then maybe the other parties should take notice and change to support the popular policies and win back support.

Also we can do more than 1 thing at a time. We should be pushing things like ranked choice voting while also showing our displeasure with the current parties where it makes sense to do so.

Giving support to third parties gives them and the issues they’re promoting more visibility to the general public.

[–] TachyonTele@lemm.ee 8 points 3 weeks ago (10 children)

The presidential election is not the time for any of that. You have a fundamental misunderstanding about how elections work if this is the only time you care about third parties.

[–] TrippyFocus@lemmy.ml 3 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

It definitely isn’t the only time I care about third parties. Continued direct action in the community is the most important way to affect change. The election is just a useful event for publicity and gaining support for groups.

There’s 0% chance my comment is going to convince enough people this election cycle that it effects a non swing states election. It’s about slowly building support for groups.

[–] TachyonTele@lemm.ee 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I'm with you. I'm all about building support. Just as long as people understand there's a time and place for it.

[–] Maeve@kbin.earth -4 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

People have said that for 40 years. It's always the right time to do the right thing.

Eta and for 40 years things have gotten worse for everyone but fat international corporate conglomerates and VERY wealthy people. The time is now.

[–] TachyonTele@lemm.ee 6 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

And for 40 years voting in your local elections has changed things. That's when you vote for change. If you think the presidential election is the time to vote differently you're not paying attention, plain and simple.

[–] Maeve@kbin.earth -3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Yes, as I said elsewhere itt ,things have gotten alarmingly worse.

[–] TachyonTele@lemm.ee 4 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

No, what you said was people have been saying the same thing for 40 years, and implied it doesn't make a difference.

That is false.

[–] Maeve@kbin.earth -3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Do you know what "elsewhere" means? Okay, I may not have used the word "alarmingly."

[–] TachyonTele@lemm.ee 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Your not even American. Fuck off with your bullshit.

[–] Maeve@kbin.earth -4 points 3 weeks ago

Georgia surprised us before, maybe they will again.

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