this post was submitted on 05 Sep 2024
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[–] Redjard@lemmy.dbzer0.com 40 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (22 children)

You know, thinking about it, I doubt this is a coincidence.

The finger-counting is familiar to me as a technique for lucid dreaming. If you look at your hands in a dream, your brain will kinda fuck it up, so if you train yourself to pay attention to that you realize you are dreaming and become lucid.

My guess is that the origin of fae is something like sleep paralysis deamons or hallucinations, and people realized they could detect those from the same flaws of our own imagination.

Now for AI, it isn't really drawing. What we are using in image-AI is still much more like projecting up a mental image, dreaming. We can't get it right all at once either, even our human brain is not good enough at it, it is reasonable image-AI makes the same kind of mistakes.

The next step would logically be to emulate the drawing process. You need to imagine up an image, then observe it at large, check for inconsistencies using reasoning and visual intuition.
Hone in on any problems, stuff that doesn't look right or doesn't make sense. Lines not straight.
Then start reimagining those sections, applying learned techniques and strategies, painter stuff (I am not an artist).
Loosely I imagine the ai operating a digital drawing program with a lot of extra unusual tools like paste imagination or telepathic select, or morph from mind.

The main thing differentiating dreaming from painting is that for painting you can "write stuff down" and don't have to keep it all in your head all the time. This allows you to iterate and focus in without loosing all the detail everywhere else.

[–] chuckleslord@lemmy.world 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

It's not about the medium being used, it's that AI doesn't know what things are. You and I have a living library of how a 3D object works in space. When you train your artistic abilities, all you're really doing is perfecting that internal library and learning the techniques to bring it out of your own head.

When you draw an apple, you bring forth the concept of an apple in your mind and then put that down on the page. When an AI draws an apple, it creates a statistically probable image of an apple based on its training data. It doesn't know what an apple is, it just makes something that was good enough to pass the testing machine.

AIs make products like a dream, because just like in your dreams, there's no reality to anchor it to. You hallucinate fairly similarly to AIs, even while waking, but your brain then adjusts its guesses using sensory inputs. Like why you can feel the pain of a stubbed toe instantly, if you see it, even though it actual takes the chemical signal some time to get to your brain. Or how your brain will synchronize the sound coming out of someone's mouth with the image, even though that's not what is actually happening. And an AI will never be able to do that, because all inputs are identical to it.

[–] grandkaiser@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Your brain doesn’t have a single module that knows what an apple is. Instead, different parts work together to form the concept. The occipital lobe in particular, processes how an apple looks, but it doesn't "know" what an apple is—it just handles visual characteristics. When these various modules combine, they produce your idea of an apple, which is then interpreted by another part of the brain.

When you decide to draw an apple, your brain sends signals to the cerebellum to move your hands. The cerebellum doesn’t know what an apple is either. It simply follows instructions to draw shapes based on input from other brain regions that handle motor skills and artistic representation. Even those parts don’t fully understand what an apple is—they just act on synaptic patterns related to it.

AI, by comparison, is missing many of these modules. It doesn’t know the taste or scent of an apple because it lacks sensory input for taste or scent. AI lacks a Cerebral Cortex, Reticular Activating System, Posterior Parietal Cortex, Anterior Cingulate Cortex, and the necessary supporting structures to experience consciousness, so it doesn’t “know” or “sense” anything in the way a human brain does. Instead, AI works through patterns and data, never experiencing the world as we do.

This is why AI often creates dream-like images. It can see and replicate patterns similar to the synaptic patterns created by the occipital lobes in the brain, but without the grounding of consciousness or the other sensory inputs and corrections that come from real-world experience, its creations lack the coherence and depth of human perception. AI doesn't have the lived understanding or context, leading to images that can feel abstract or surreal, much like dreams.

[–] chuckleslord@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Yes! Exactly! You had the next thought that I did.

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