this post was submitted on 20 Jun 2023
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Imagine being such an unbelievable dumbarse that you think mindless torture is the same as natural carnivorous dietary habits.
Humans can easily thrive without meat or any other animal products, that means consuming it is purely preference, preferring to hurt animals because you like the taste of their corpses instead of just eating plants, is fucked up.
Downvoting me doesn't make needless killing any less cruel.
Plants are living things too, right? So why is it ok to eat them but not animals? Are you saying we should not eat plants too, because it also harm a living thing and we should all just die?
How about any carnivorous animals (which surprise, we are partially) do they need to stop eating meat too?
You misunderstand the ethics of veganism. Vegans aim to reduce suffering. So far, science points to most animals being likely to suffer similarly to how we as humans suffer, since we share evolutionary history and similar biological systems.
Plants do not share these systems, nor have any evolutionary pressure to be able to suffer or feel pain, since they would not be able to do anything about it anyway
It's not a blanket "living things are sacred"
Furthermore, if you really cared at all about the poor suffering plants, you'd know that the vast vast majority of plants grown by humans are fed inefficiently to animals. So, by going vegan, you'd be hugely reducing the number of plants you are causing harm to
Finally, carnivorous animals have literally nothing to do with veganism. Please stop trying to discredit a movement you don't even understand
I mean we are a species have deficiencies without supplements if having a full vegan diet, how can you say we don't need animal products when not using them causes our body problems?
The only supplement needed on a plant based diet is B12, which is very easy to get.
Meat eaters also supplement B12, it's just that the animals are fed the supplements before you eat them.
Do you also reject all other modern human inventions?
https://www.saintlukeskc.org/about/news/research-shows-vegan-diet-leads-nutritional-deficiencies-health-problems-plant-forward#:~:text=Compared%20to%20the%20standard%20American,%2C%20and%20high%2Dquality%20protein.
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You gotta make sure any diet you eat is healthy, of course, thriving on a plant based diet is easily achievable.
Plenty of people with meat-filled diets experience deficiencies all the time so eating meat also may lead to nutritional deficiencies.
Oh, of course, and tbh I kinda agree with a lot of what vegans have to say but I also know that tbh most people are not going to go vegan.
I know you probably think I am sitting here eating a steak now and that I only want to eat meat at this point but not really, I am actively trying to reduce meat in general in my diet and replace it with more veggies both for health and moral reasons. I can also think that (most) farms should absolutely treat animals better before slaughter. I can also agree that there are some animal products that are just unethical imo like veal or any baby animal used for food, or say a Foie gras.
But I also know that I am unlikely to cut ALL meat out of my diet, and I can also find the slaughter of far older animals to be less morally unjust, I mean I am ok with people taking what ever body part from me when I die, it's why I am an organ donor, I would like to still be useful somehow after death.
may...
You gotta make sure any diet you eat is healthy of course, thriving on a plant based diet is easily achievable.
Plenty of people with meat-filled diets experience deficiencies all the time.
You're calling someone an unbelievable dumbarse and then immediately using a logical fallacy, who's the dumbarse here?
An appeal to nature is a pathetic defense. It's natural to rape and murder too, but obviously we recognise that those are negative things that should be avoided. Why do you think needlessly killing an animal is any different?
You don't need to rape or murder to live, you need food to survive, kinda two different things.
Humans can easily thrive with a plant based diet.
Food yes, animals products no
For big slaughter houses etc it is the same. The animals there a tortured on a daily basis. I'm not saying all meat eaters are evil, there are small local farms where animals can live a good life. But the large scale industrial meat (and dairy) production is just this.
Unless the only reason you're enjoying your beef is because you enjoy thinking about how the animal was suffering to produce it, the two are not the same.
I'm not saying the meat industry isn't evil, but it's not torture for the sake of torture. They just don't give a shit and are only concerned about profits, which is messed up but not the same.
So it is better to kill, torture and abuse animals for profit than for fun?
In the meat industry, animal suffering is not the goal. The goal is to deliver as much product (food in this case) to the consumer as cheaply as possible. Animal suffering is a byproduct of this because on a large enough scale, both the consumer and the capitalists running the slaughterhouses are far enough removed from the animals that they don't have to confront the moral questions of what they're putting these animals through.
I agree that it's still a disgusting practice, but it's not the same thing as deliberately harming animals for your own amusement. In the meat industry, some people can hand-wave those moral concerns away by saying to themselves "at least the animals died for something good: to feed countless families". Whether you agree with that reasoning or not (which, for the record, I do not), that same person can't use that excuse in the case of these monkeys. It's just pointless suffering for the amusement of a handful of psychopaths.
But it kinda is tho isn't it?
Paying someone to kill animals because you like the taste of their corpses is basically harming animals for your own amusement.
Yes it's not just taste, also "food" but food can also just be plants so that leaves just taste aka. pleasure aka. amusement.
You're conflating the "amusement" of eating food with the amusement of killing the animals to obtain that food. They are not the same. As stated in my previous post, there is a big disconnect in most people's minds between the food they eat and the animals they come from.
But more to the point I'm trying to make, animals dying in order to feed people is different from animals being recorded while they are slowly and deliberately tortured to death as a form of entertainment. I don't know how to explain that one is worse than the other. I'm not disagreeing with you that plant based alternatives are preferable to meat in order to avoid the suffering of animals, but I'm also not understanding why you feel the need to bring that up in the comments of this article. The issue described in the article is fundamentally different from that of the meat industry.
Even small local farms are still needlessly killing animals for profit/taste
Humans aren't "naturally carnivorous"