this post was submitted on 30 Jul 2023
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Piracy: ꜱᴀɪʟ ᴛʜᴇ ʜɪɢʜ ꜱᴇᴀꜱ

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Hi guys, first of all, I fully support Piracy. But Im writing a piece on my blog about what I might considere as "Ethical Piracy" and I would like to hear your concepts of it.

Basically my line is if I have the capacity of paying for something and is more convinient that pirating, ill pay. It happens to me a lot when I wanna watch a movie with my boyfriend. I like original audio, but he likes dub, so instead of scrapping through the web looking for a dub, I just select the language on the streaming platform. That is convinient to me.

In what situations do you think is not OK to pirate something? And where is 100 justified and everybody should sail the seas instead?

I would like to hear you.

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[–] Aceticon@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Even in the very strict sense of "ethical" (pretty much a simpleton's "Ethics == Law"), I would say that Abandonware is abolutely ethical to pirate.

By its own definition it's software that is not being commercialized anymore, so nobody "loses" (if you use the current intellectual property legislation to defined winning/losing) any copyright income when somebody else copies it without paying them because there are no options for those people to get it by paying - even by the most fantastical definition of it, it's not a "lost sale".

Now, if the copyright owners resume commercialization of it, then it stops being abandonware hence stops being ethical to pirate it under this definition.

That said, for me anything that's outside the copyright length in the original legilsation (14 years) before Disney bought themselves extension after extension until the current "lifetime of the author + 70 years" (which adds up to around 150 years) is absolutelly ethical to pirate (or if you want to ponder on the Ethics of it: "Is it ethical to obbey a Law or a change of it which was bought?!").

[–] riley0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 year ago

Everyone wants us to subscribe. This a.m. I listened to some guy on the internet rant about HP shutting down his printer remotely b/c he'd bought a subscription, when he bought the printer (didn't read fine print in contract/TOS--that's another rant), to a certain number of pages/month. His credit card number changed, HP didn't get their tithe, so they remotely disabled his printer. Entertainment moguls suck up all the money in that industry, leaving little for artists--to wit, the strikes--and streaming subscriptions are expensive. Cable prices are ridiculous. Corporate greed and having every subscriber subsidize sports channels probably account for that. Everything costs too much, and my budget is small. Original Star Trek and original Doctor Who were broadcast over the air. In exchange for commercials, we got to watch for free. If I could subscribe to iplayer, that would satisfy my needs. Alas, I don't live in UK, and BBC's arrangements with multinational entertainment corps preclude my subscription. So I pay for a good VPN. That's still more than it used to cost to watch. Tropicana OJ used to have a commercial showing people sticking straws right into an orange to suck its juice. I often feel like the orange. Piracy is ethical.

[–] squash_squash@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Piracy is always ethical unless you undoubtedly show proof that it harmed someone.

I give you a hint: it almost never actually does.

[–] Hikermick@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

I'll pirate music via Soulseek. If I listen to something a lot I may pay for the music but more likely I'll see them when they tour then buy stuff from their merch table. This is small stage stuff, the big mega acts not so much

[–] NicolasVerdi@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'd like to ask myself the opposite, when is it unethical to pirate? Because it's just data, and how many copies there are of it shouldn't change anything. If I want to support a developer I'd 'buy the product', regardless of already having it or not, and I would never in my life buy a product (Not a service, just the data) just because I cannot get it otherwise. I believe it's pretty much the same for most people that knows how to download pirated content.

But I believe that early leaks are strongly unethical, as you end up interfering in the creative and production process before it's ready. Furthermore, a lot of people whom usually won't pirate will jump at the possibility of doing so just for the hype of getting the product NOW, and maybe will not feel the necessity of buying later. I cannot think any case in which a leak is ethical or even beneficial for anyone, and I'm surprised that I've never seen much push against it by pirates.

[–] BillDoor@feddit.uk 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I just commented something similar, asking for examples of when piracy is unethical, because I couldn't think of any myself, but your example of leaking is really interesting.

I can see how pirating/leaking an unfinished work could be really harmful to the creator and I know that would feel horrible if it happened to something I'd created.

I'm not sure why there's so much acceptance of (and even enthusiasm for) early leaked unfinished products.

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[–] Fisch@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Nintendo games getting leaked helps emulator developers to iron out issues before most people start playing. Most recent example is tears of the kingdom.

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[–] TheAmishMan@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

I find it's very context dependent. In the 3d model/printables, a lot of people who release the pirated content so a 3-4 month embargo to allow the creator a chance to let people get it legally before it's available everywhere.

[–] hemko@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Downloading a copy of media or software is just a copy. You can make infinite copies, and you're not taking anything away from the creator for copying it.

Thus all piracy is ethical.

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[–] Pokethat@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

If a product can be offered without much issue on a pay once and own-as-is forever model, then I think there is an ethical imperative to pirate it.

I would be willing to pay a few hundred bucks for a perpetual license to look 2023 version of Adobe Lightroom. Unfortunately the only place to find such a product is on the high seas. Adobe will only let you buy a subscription based equivalent. I like the actual software product, and I've gotten good at using it, but if I can't just buy it, I'm not going to pay for it.

I actually have a plug-in for Lightroom called topaz Labs AI enhancement suite. I pay for a single year's worth of updates, but I can still use the software as of the final update forever. If Adobe actually offered something like that I would be all over it.

[–] mr_right@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 year ago

everything and nothing

[–] HurlingDurling@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

To me it's like buying a physical book, but then downloading a drm version of the ebook.

[–] CrowAirbrush@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

There is no value in spending money anymore, you used to get some long term benefits. You bought movies, music and games for example and got to use them however long you want to. Now you pay significantly more under the guise of: "it's only x amount per month" and own nothing.

For me, something like Spotify is far too expensive, considering i could buy an album from the discount bin for like €2 and play it for a full year until i got slightly bored (you still owned and got to use it after that). Spotify is €11 a month, times 12 compared to a single €2 permanent purchase. I usually only bought one or 2 albums per year.

I'm not saying you need to agree with this, but for me it makes absolutely no sense to pay this much especially when i look at my wage not going up and the cost of living having doubled over the past few years.

[–] padge@lemmy.zip 1 points 1 year ago

I used to be a lot less lenient in the past, but as I've gotten older and DRM and streaming services have gotten worse I've been sailing the high seas more. Now I'll do it if there's no reasonably easy/convenient way to buy it in my country, if the work is old/big enough that nobody creatively involved is going to notice, or if I already bought the same or similar version in the past (such as wanting a movie for my Plex server that I know my parents have on DVD somewhere). Sometimes I'll "acquire" something and end up financially supporting it down the line if I like it.

I do agree with some of the other comments though, that for things like software where there's an alternate FOSS or independent version, I'll go for that. I've begun getting in the habit of donating or paying one-time purchases (such as ad removal) on software I use a lot.

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