this post was submitted on 30 Jun 2023
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I've tried to search for opinions on what's going on in Ukraine, but most posts are incredibly old. I'm not too educated on the matter myself (well, aside from keeping up most of the time with what cities are under whose control and all of that). I haven't really heard much about the geopolitical side of things, and it's hard to know what's disinfo or not; That's why I'd like to ask: What is your stance on the Ukraine war?

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[–] Drewfro66@lemmygrad.ml -1 points 1 year ago (17 children)

Prior to 2014, Ukraine has usually had Russian-friendly governments. Some more than others, but relations between the two countries were generally close, if sometimes strained.

In 2014 there was a coup in the Ukraine (or a revolution, or a series of protests that resulted in the president stepping down, whatever) called Euromaidan. These protests involved Neo-Nazi paramilitary groups (which are very common in Ukraine) marching in the streets. The government that emerged afterwards was solidly anti-Russian.

Separatists in the Donbass region (Eastern Ukraine, the parts that Russia is now occupying, which is about 50% Russian) immediately began trying to secede. Elections stopped being held in these regions, solidifying the anti-Russian government. Crimea, which is almost 100% Russian, was retaken by Russia with almost no resistance.

The Ukrainian War started in 2014 when the post-Euromaidan Ukrainian government began using artillery, snipers, and fascist paramilitary volunteers against the Donbass separatists. 2022 was just when the Russians decided to get involved.

The Russian government claims that the invasion was in order to "De-Nazify" Ukraine. The motivation to protect the Russian ethnic minority was also clear, but since Russia is a multi-ethnic federation, saying this sort of thing is a political no-no in Russia.

In reality, Russia invaded because Ukraine was considering membership in NATO. In 2008, Georgia was similarly considering membership in NATO. Russia then invaded and liberated the provinces of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, which remain independent to this day, and stationed troops in these regions permanently. This was done because, if they allowed Georgia into NATO, it would require NATO to defend Georgia; since NATO membership requires approval of all existing members, there is always going to be at least one member who is not eager for immediate war with Russia. This is the same thing that is happening in Ukraine: Russia is permanently occupying parts of Ukraine so that, if Ukraine were to join NATO, NATO would be obligated to "defend" them against Russia.

[–] BillyBadBoy@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (4 children)

You have no idea what you are talking about. Where do i even begin to correct you?

I strongly suggest you to watch the russian roulette series by vice news. The also were at the euromaidan. And they shot some crazy footage there.

I the video you will see that the euromaidan wasnt just a bunch of nazis protesting. Far from it. Those were some ordinay people. Who were fighting for a better country. For all the values who seem to be incompatible whit the russain government. Holding ukaine hostage.

Just like belarus isnt realy a country on its own. Its more like a proxy state run by russia.

[–] rosered@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I appreciate that you mentioned that vice news series, it's always nice to see something new. But, you're absolutely wrong about the EuroMaidan protests, neo-nazis played a huge role in it. Check out this article that also includes photo and video evidence regarding it: https://www.salon.com/2014/02/25/is_the_us_backing_neo_nazis_in_ukraine_partner/

[–] BillyBadBoy@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Maby start with this video instead, it shows footage from the vice docu and does a bit of a better job explaining it, i I am really interested in your opinion on it.

https://youtu.be/obMTYs30E9A

I have read the article but a lot of the links arnt working on my phone. I will try give a proper response to it soon.

But to say that the euromaidan was a uprising by nazis is such a misrepresentation. I have never seen nazis openly protesting to join the EU. I would rather call them ultra natianolists.

To be a nazi is different in every country, depending on it history. To call people a nazi leaves out so much details en glosses over all the cultural differences. And i do think russia is using this.

The russians are the agressors in this war, and putin is a political leader with absolute power. For me this is definatly what it means to be a nazi.

Ther might be some nazi sypathizers in ukraine, but none of it is institutionalised.

[–] Bl00dyH3ll@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)
  1. Your definition of nazi means that Americans are nazis.
  2. Having an open nazi battalion in your army is the definition of institutionalized.
[–] BillyBadBoy@lemmy.world -2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)
  1. Correct (my homecountry has been a nazi to a few colonies itsdlf aswell)

Waving a nazi flag is one thing. But shooting random civillians, taking territory, concentration camps, deportation. Makes you a real nazi. Al of these thing are normal in the russian army. While ukranians are actively trying to do better.

Ukraine has a long way to go but that way is with the EU and its values.

https://youtu.be/lVkBVExuXSQ Russia should invade usa?

https://youtu.be/XQc6mJ7u8gQ Russia should invade russia?

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