Funny how all you tankies have been saying the same thing since the war began. Yet ukraine is still in it and advancing. So odd. Almost like all you tankies want people outside the warzone to ignore ukraine and give up, stop sending arms. I'm sure that's all a coincidence though.

[–] Krause@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (10 children)

ukraine is still in it and advancing

But that's just not true, in fact Russia is making gains on the north and south lines now (source for the map is the Institute for the Study of War: https://isw.pub/InteractiveUkraineWarMap)

The Washington Post: Ukraine running out of options to retake significant territory

The Economist: Ukraine’s sluggish counter-offensive is souring the public mood

CNN: “Russians have a number of defensive lines and they (Ukrainian forces) haven’t really gone through the first line,” said a senior Western diplomat. “Even if they would keep on fighting for the next several weeks, if they haven’t been able to make more breakthroughs throughout these last seven, eight weeks, what is the likelihood that they will suddenly, with more depleted forces, make them? Because the conditions are so hard.”

Almost like all you tankies want people outside the warzone to ignore ukraine and give up, stop sending arms

Yeah I want the war to end so that Ukrainian and Russian workers stop dying for the American/European/Russian elites, is that a bad thing?

[–] Fazoo@lemmy.ml 21 points 1 year ago (9 children)

Didn't realize the US and EU are to blame for Russia invading it's neighbor unprovoked. Could have sworn it was Russia trying to wrap up what they started in the "Free Republics" and Crimea.

[–] ZapataCadabra@hexbear.net 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Do you know what happened in Ukraine in the week before Feb 24 2022? Or the 8 years before that?

[–] Fazoo@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yes, I know what was actually happening in the country, but I'm sure you have some RT propaganda that only a Russian would be dumb enough to believe.

[–] culpritus@hexbear.net 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

https://natoassociation.ca/why-yanukovych-was-right-to-exercise-caution-with-the-eu-ukraine-deal-part-2/

Canadian NATO-friendly website February 9, 2014

Ukraine was hit really hard by the 2008 economic crisis and is still struggling to recover. It has beenforecast that Ukraine will be cash-strapped in the near future and are scheduled to face approximately $ 8 billion in debt repayments next year alone. Considering all of this on the horizon, it is only sensible that Yanukovych and the Ukrainian government demand that the European Union put forward a solid plan – in the interest of its citizens- to help the soften the heavy blow that the Ukrainian economy will inevitably suffer as it is exposed to a new economic market. The EU has offered just $800 million in aid as a potential insulator against the immediate effects of joining the EU. When one considers that Ukraine thinks the immediate blow of an EU deal to its economy will be in the region of $20 billion, the EU’s proposal does not even begin to address any issues. Russia on the other hand, have offered $15 billion of economic aid to Ukraine to help mitigate any potential economic disasters in the near future. Although there are doubts as to the long term effects of the Russian offer on Ukraine’s economy, Yanukovych cannot be blamed for holding out for a better deal for his country. It is what he was elected to do. Throwing his country into a monumental deal without taking into proper consideration the immediate side effects would be amateurish.

This is supposedly the match that light the "Revolution of Dignity" that completely ignored the western Ukrainian (ethnic Russian) populace.

[–] Fazoo@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You're almost right. The match was the attempt to take the Russian deal and, knowing full well what that meant, people took to the streets.

That $15 billion would be an investment in a puppet state at Putin's beck and call. Belarus is all the evidence you need, but you can also see how well the CSTO is going for Armenia. Utterly worthless deals.

[–] culpritus@hexbear.net 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

There's data available here if you want to see the numbers yourself:
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/UKR/ukraine/gdp-gross-domestic-product

1992 was the start of CSTO.

Ukraine GDP per capita 1992 = $1418 Ukraine GDP per capita 2021 = $4828

Armenia GDP per capita 1992 = $356 Armenia GDP per capita 2021 = $4967

Belarus GDP per capita 1992 = $1668 Belarus GDP per capita 2021 = $7490

Care to elaborate on your comment in light of this data?

[–] LordR@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

Cherrypicking data after a huge economic crisis and showing growth. Wow. Incredible. Just as a comparison:

Poland GDP per Capita 1992: $2459
Poland GDP per Capita 2021: $17999

[–] Fazoo@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

The fact CSTO has a defense clause which Russia has failed to follow through on multiple times? You talk economic growth, cherry picking stats you like, when I'm talking about the core foundation of a defense pact. The defense. Not once has the group actually defended a member state during an armed conflict, specifically the ongoing fight between Armenia and Azerbaijan.

It is a toothless pact. I'll let Lord handle your stat nonsense, since that wasn't the point of me mentioning CSTO.

[–] culpritus@hexbear.net -2 points 1 year ago

You do not dispute the economics from the article or my comments.

marx-ok

load more comments (7 replies)

load more comments (10 replies)