this post was submitted on 20 Jul 2023
417 points (76.2% liked)
Asklemmy
43945 readers
873 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- !lemmy411@lemmy.ca: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
This is a very difficult thread for me, because you’ve immediately started it from what feels like an insincere position of insisting on the polite debate of a system that has actively harmed innumerable people. And continues to do so.
While I don’t deny that polite debate is preferable to flame wars and anger, you’ve come in here to try and debate a subject that raises passions.
And the reason I say this from the outset is because of comments like this;
The ‘rules’ in this case have been defined. Most countries have rules in place to govern the environmental impact of industry. But companies led by capitalists ignore those rules as far as they can, which is how we are where we are.
Here in the UK, we have record breaking amounts of sewage and pollution in our rivers, because our water companies are run by capitalists to turn a profit. The fines from the government are ultimately paid by those of us who pay our water bills. The people in charge continue to pay themselves and their shareholders well.
And this is where capitalism fails miserably, in my opinion. As noted in another comment in here: capitalism is built for profits, not for human comfort. Businesses who pollute know full well that they should reduce their emissions, clean up their waste, and be better global citizens, but left unchecked, they won’t. You admit yourself in that quoted comment, that capitalism needs a set of rules around carbon credits and such to address the problem. They know there’s a problem, but are waiting for governments to force them to clean up their act.
That doesn’t make me feel that capitalism is the kind, loving economic system we all need. Quite the opposite.